Author Topic: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness  (Read 55220 times)

Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #179 on: October 25, 2016, 17:20:59 PM »
YES IT IS

https://www.naturesbest.co.uk/vitamin-b12-1000-methylcobalamin-p621/#tabreviews

AND HAVE JUST SPOKEN TO THE PHARMACIST AT MY CHEMIST........HAD TO GO IN TO GET MEDS AND HE SAYS NO DANGER AND  THE WORST IS THEY MAY NOT WORK BUT TO LET HIM KNOW HOW IT GOES.

APPARENTLY THE HIGHER DOES 1000MU IS BETTER THAN THE LOWER DOSE AND SHOULD SHOW AT TOP OF THE LINK.

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #178 on: October 25, 2016, 15:40:39 PM »
Make sure it is the methylcobalamin - the one that absorbs easier

Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #177 on: October 25, 2016, 15:20:49 PM »
I USED TO MANAGE TO GET THE NEEDLE TO GO OUT THE OTHER SIDE AND ALSO INTO ME A COUPLE OG TIMES!

TAKES PRACTICE TO GET IT RIGHT!

I USED TO DO ONE INJECTION FOR 7 DAYS  ABOUT EVERY 2-4 MONTHS SO YOU WILL BE AN EXPERT.

I TOO AM THINKING OF TRYING THE B12............FOUND A GOOD SITE TO BUY FROM

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #176 on: October 25, 2016, 14:28:16 PM »
Sky is doing much better - I'm never sure I have managed to inject the insulin fully as sometimes her fur is wet from it but I think that is from when I'm withdrawing the needle.  Her back leg weakness is still there but not expecting miracles from that at the moment.

When I look at reviews for B12 I may start taking it for me! :)

Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #175 on: October 24, 2016, 22:24:52 PM »
THANKS AND WONDER WHY NOBODY MENTIONS THIS! WHEN I ASKED IF ANYTHING COULD BE DONE I WAS TOLD NO! I BADLY BURNT MY TOES LAST YEAR AFTER DROPPING BOILING WATER ON THEM BUT DIDNT FEEL A THING! HOT FEELS COLD TO ME.

I DONT TAKE AND NEVER HAVE TAKEN METAFORMIN BUT IT IS THE DRUG THAT THEY TEND TO PRESCRIBE FIRST.

I WILL HAVE TO LOOK INTO THIS MORE BUT THINK BOTTOM OF LEGS AND FEET GETTING WORSE.

SO HOW IS SKY DOING?

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #174 on: October 24, 2016, 18:15:20 PM »
B12 can be taken by humans - if you are going to try it use the methylcobalamin version as that is the most easily absorbed.  I do take internet sites with a pinch of salt as you don't know what/who is behind them.  B12 methylcobalamin is good for nerve problems.  Even if it doesn't work, the low toxicity means it shouldn't cause any harm.

This from a Podiatry site:

Can Vitamin B12 (Methylcobalamin) Supplementation Have An Impact For Diabetic Neuropathy?

Increasingly, we have identified the role of vitamin B12 in diabetic neuropathy and the need to supplement B12 in the patient with diabetes. Metformin, the most commonly utilized drug for the treatment of diabetes, is associated with worsening of diabetic neuropathy due to the inhibition of folic acid and B12 absorption as a result of the effects of metformin.10

Authors have demonstrated that the malabsorption of B12 and decreased folate levels associated with metformin result in an increased homocysteine level and increased risk of neuropathy.11,12 The administration of B12 may be associated with a reversal of these effects. Homocysteine, when elevated, results in endothelial damage and decreased blood flow to peripheral nerve tissue by thrombus formation within the vascular supply to the nerve. In addition, homocysteine impairs the coupling of arginine and oxygen for the formation of nitric oxide, which is necessary to maintain vascular supply and normal nerve function.13 Cobalamin deficiency, which is exacerbated by the utilization of metformin, increases risk of neuropathy. B12 supplementation can be helpful in the reversal of this deficiency and neuropathy.

In addition to those patients utilizing metformin, researchers have demonstrated that vitamin B12 deficiency and folate deficiency are associated with increased levels of homocysteine, increased oxidative stress secondary to low levels of glutathione, and decreased total antioxidant activity.14 Bailey and colleagues noted that cobalamin deficiency is common and the majority of cases are subclinical.15 In addition, they have suggested that cobalamin serum testing is unreliable.

Solomon demonstrated that functional B12 deficiency is common in the elderly and common in 62 percent of patients with diabetic neuropathy.16 In these patients, normal serum cobalamin levels were associated with markers for B12 deficiency such as elevated levels of methylmalonic acid and the presence of neuropathy. Solomon showed that the administration of cobalamin reversed the effects of functional B12 deficiency in many patients.

Wyckoff and Ganji demonstrated that vitamin B12 deficiency may exist even in the presence of patients who presumably have a "large intake" of B12.17 They further demonstrated that classic markers of B12 deficiency such as macrocytic anemia are not reliable markers for B12 deficiency.

The administration of methylcobalamin at 1,500 mcg per day has been associated with normalization of hemoglobin A1c and improved motor conduction velocity, thereby suggesting that vitamin B12 therapy may be helpful in the reversal of diabetic motor neuropathy, or symptoms such as cramping.18 Others have demonstrated that the administration of methylcobalamin at 1,500 mcg daily was associated over three months with relieved muscle cramping, improvement in motor conduction velocity, reduction in neuropathic pain and improvement in two point discrimination, suggesting nerve regrowth.19

Yaqub and co-workers have demonstrated that methylcobalamin improves not only sensory but autonomic nerve dysfunction symptoms as well.20 With reference to autonomic neuropathy, multiple studies have demonstrated the reversal of autonomic signs, autonomic symptoms and the normalization of autonomic nerve dysfunction with the administration of methylcobalamin.21,22 Authors have also described a potential neuroprotective effect together with reversal of symptomatic sensory and autonomic neuropathy.23-26</size>

Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #173 on: October 24, 2016, 15:58:33 PM »
HOW IS SKY DOING?

I HAVE DIABETIC NEUROPATHY WHICH THEY SAY CANT BE REVERSED............WONDER WHY B12 WOULDNT WORK FOR A HUMAN!

I WOULD LOVE TO BE ABLE TO FEEL MY FEET AGAIN!

Offline Judecat (Paula)

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #172 on: October 17, 2016, 11:59:13 AM »
That is such good news, I am smiling too :hug: :hug: :hug:
Oscar Wilde on his adored Mog "The Mighty Atom that purrs and furrs"

Offline Dawn F

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #171 on: October 17, 2016, 08:42:51 AM »
so glad to hear things are improving  :hug:

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #170 on: October 17, 2016, 08:30:01 AM »
This is such good news to read.  Am smiling bigly.   :) :hug:

Offline Lyn (Slugsta)

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Re: Modified title - Sky's diabetes / Hind leg weakness
« Reply #169 on: October 16, 2016, 22:45:19 PM »
Fingers crossed indeed!

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #168 on: October 16, 2016, 19:54:00 PM »
After looking at how well she responded to a small dose I'm really surprised we didn't kill  her the first week as she must have really been overdosed on it!   :Crazy:

Started her on a B12 supplement today which is supposed to help reverse the symptoms of diabetic neuropathy - her hind leg weakness.  She has improved over the last week getting up stairs - she has run up half of them, a bit ungainly but still more of a run than a hobble - so I really think we have got to the bottom of what is wrong with her.  The insulin alone should help with the weakness but the B12 could speed it along.

Fingers crossed.

Offline Judecat (Paula)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #167 on: October 15, 2016, 12:22:31 PM »
Sorry I haven't been keeping up with this thread with extended holiday etc.

I am pleased that you have finally got a correct diagnosis for Sky, stressful though it has been it does sound as if you are getting on top of it. Hopefully once she is properly stabilised it will get a lot easier, thank goodness she is such a sweetie :Luv:
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Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #166 on: October 15, 2016, 00:28:02 AM »
THATS GREAT  ;D ;D

HAD ENOUGH OF SMALL TYPE CANT READ ANYMORE

Offline Dawn F

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #165 on: October 14, 2016, 09:20:56 AM »
great news  :hug:

Offline Lyn (Slugsta)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #164 on: October 13, 2016, 21:55:37 PM »
Good girl Sky!  :gold stars:

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #163 on: October 13, 2016, 20:53:38 PM »
Sky's doing well  :attention: :attention: :attention:

She is to stay on her current dosage and go back in a month for a fructose test which is showing a longer lasting snapshot of how she has got on over a month.

This may not make sense but basically fluorescent green is really bad (dangerous). On the other side black is bad as means glucose is to high. The rest are on a sliding scale of badness!  Dark green is best.  She made it into the dark green range and most was blue so they are very impressed with her.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kCFXU61aTK78S-l-Et1LQZB17o3557O8_V9PLfL3HMg/pubhtml

So proud of my girl :)

Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #162 on: October 11, 2016, 02:43:58 AM »
YES STRESS PUTS UP THE LEVELS BUT SOMETIMES MY FINGERS WILL NOT BLEED SO I CAN IMAGINE HOW HARD IT MUST BE WITH A CAT  :hug: :hug: :hug:

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #161 on: October 10, 2016, 16:26:12 PM »
Booked her in to have the vets do her glucose curve on Thursday.   She won't like it and may get high levels if she is stressed but can't keep trying here.  She is losing clumps of fur through stress now.  Keeping her on low dosage until her tests ate done.

If we can't get blood from anywhere we can test her urine but it won't be as regular as bloods as dependant on her performing. :)

Poor Sky.  We are still OK on injections though so half the battle is won.

Offline Dawn F

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #160 on: October 10, 2016, 12:40:27 PM »
its so stressful, I really feel for you  :hug:

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #159 on: October 10, 2016, 12:08:28 PM »
Well done.   :hug:

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #158 on: October 10, 2016, 10:12:21 AM »
Fortunately she's recovered okay.  She had an insulin free day on Saturday and dropped doseage to 2 instead of 5 yesterday.  Vet said 3 but as I can't get blood from her I wasn't risking it.  Tried blood from her paw and nothing.  Going to try again from her ear as I have to be able to monitor her.

Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #157 on: October 09, 2016, 01:26:33 AM »
SORRY TO HEAR SKY IS DIABETICS BUT THANK GOODNSS SHE IS FAIRLY PLACID.

BEING A DIABETICS I CAN UNDERSTAND HOW HARD IT IS FOR YOU AND SOUNDS LIKE THE INSULIN DOSE IS TOO HIGH OR TOO OFTEN BUT IF LIKE A HUMAN IT WILL CHANGE DEPENDING ON WHAT AND HOW MUCH SHE NEEDS.

I USED TO GIVE NAPOLEON IMJECTIONS OF ABS AND WOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN ABLE TO PULL THE PLUNGER UP!!

GOOD LUCK TO BOTH OF YOU AND HOPE THAT ALL GOES WELL AS YOU BECOME MORE USED TO DOING ALL THIS.

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #156 on: October 08, 2016, 07:28:31 AM »
Don't be harsh on yourself.  This is totally uncharted territory for you both, and you will come to trust your gut instinct.  Sending soothing vibes for Skye xxxx

I know, I'm just annoyed with myself.  Was too focused on not missing a dose as she is supposedly having a blood curve on Sunday rather than the consequences of her having it when she is not well.

She's brighter this morning than she's been for a few days - wanting affection and being purry.  Not giving her insulin today at all - sod the curve!  I have to ring the vet later to see what to do with her but I am really leaning towards letting them look after her for a few days to get her on the right doseage.  Sod's law I have to go somewhere today so can't take her in but I know she will be fine at home and if she has to go in I  have someone who can take her. 

Thank goodness for insurance! I almost cancelled it last year but so glad I kept it going!!

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #155 on: October 08, 2016, 06:21:30 AM »
Don't be harsh on yourself.  This is totally uncharted territory for you both, and you will come to trust your gut instinct.  Sending soothing vibes for Skye xxxx

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #154 on: October 08, 2016, 01:39:48 AM »
She's going to be the death of me!  I went against my instinct tonight and almost paid the price.  She's been a little bit subdued for a few days - a bit up and down which I would expect as her body becomes used to the insulin.  Last night she didn't come and greet me when I came home from work - this is totally out of character for her.  She was eating fine so gave her injections and that was that. Today she has been quiet again apparently - has eaten but not really gone out of her way to get food.

She just didn't seem well - nothing could put my finger on but she just seemed off.   I was going to try and get some blood before giving her her insulin but she perked up for her tea and as I was on my own and would struggle I didn't bother (I don't normally try and take blood before she gets her injections but probably should now......).  I struggled with the injection for some reason and thought I had hurt her as she struggled a little bit.  She then slept the rest of the night (not unusual for her but with hindsight she was a little limp).

Ate supper normally but then just sat on the kitchen floor just staring into space which was odd - she looked at me when I spoke to her but didn't interact. Usually she would go straight to bed - creature of habit.  I took her blood (and I sadly hurt her in the process so really need to get a better way of doing it!) and the machine beeped at me - it only does that if there is a problem. She had gone hypo with sugars at 2.2. :o

Phone call and dash to emergency vet (after giving her honey). She was at 3.1 in the vets but had to get to 4 before she would be released.  Managed to hit the 4 so she is back home and hopefully not at immediate risk.  Not giving her her shot tomorrow and having to sort out a different treatment plan for her - may get them to look after her for a few days to get her regulated as I can't go through that again.

I'm just annoyed with myself for not trusting myself - I shouldn't have done tonight's insulin without testing her when I thought she wasn't right.

She's a bit brighter now but need to keep an eye on her!

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #153 on: October 06, 2016, 06:38:19 AM »
Yes, I can understand why you'd be dreading it, but work with your successes first of all.    :hug:  :)

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #152 on: October 05, 2016, 20:54:51 PM »
I have blood  :Crazy:

She wasn't impressed but managed to get blood out of her so I've cancelled the appt tomorrow - I'm not keep practicing as will only stress her but I know I can do it.

Her sugars were at 12.2 which still seems high but better than 23.2!  Glucose curve on Sunday - blood testing every hour........dreading it!

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #151 on: October 05, 2016, 07:39:02 AM »
If the way you were shown isn't working for you, the vet needs to be able to give you an alternative, so push them for one.   :hug:

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #150 on: October 04, 2016, 18:54:08 PM »
She is showing signs of intolerance for the bloods.  Tried on and off all day and cannot get anything from her and she's getting fed up.  I've explored the Internet and there isn't any site that says you take blood like I've been shown - even the instructions on the box don't show it that way.  The nurse said I had to go in her ear and prick the raised bits.  Nothing.  Internet says to go for the marginal vein.  I tried that and hurt her so suspect the needle is wrong for that way  (if that is possible!).

Booked in again on Thursday to try again.

She is bit enjoying this but is easy to do the injections.

Offline Lyn (Slugsta)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #149 on: October 03, 2016, 19:08:16 PM »
Bless her furry little paws!

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #148 on: October 03, 2016, 18:02:31 PM »
She was holding onto her blood tonight so couldn't check!  Had her ears prodded about 10 times and not even a pinprick of blood.  Told the vet to stop doing it in the end as she just wasn't getting anywhere. 

I've to try again on Sunday - every hour for the glucose curve. Going to look on YouTube to see if there is a different way. 

She's still an angel but was getting fed up!

Offline Sue P (Paddysmum)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #147 on: October 03, 2016, 14:00:18 PM »
 :hug: :hug:  Got fingers crossed you'll notice an improvement within the first few days.

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #146 on: October 03, 2016, 13:05:53 PM »
2 injections done and no problem    ;D The only thing I can't manage to do is after I have injected her I'm supposed to pull back the plunger slightly to see if there is any blood in it and I can't manage to do it for some reason. So I've injected the insulin and hoped for the best!  Not sure I would be as confident with a wriggly cat but she just sits there and waits for me to do it :)

She is as good as I expect her to be, doesn't flinch and doesn't seem to notice that I am doing horrible things to her.   Tonight will see if it is making any difference - though is probably too early to see. 

Offline Lyn (Slugsta)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #145 on: September 29, 2016, 22:13:29 PM »
I'm sure you will soon get used to the injections and bloodtests. I remember my first (human) injection was really scary but it didn't stay that way for long!

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #144 on: September 29, 2016, 20:13:43 PM »
I'm mildly scared about these injections!  I can't seem to scruff her enough to get the needle in properly - fortunately she is a super cat and isn't bothering at all at my efforts (don't worry I'm not actually injecting her at the moment!).  I tried in the vets with a water solution and hurt her the first time. Second time I managed okay but now been let loose to manage!  I'm not starting until Sunday night as I'm away until then and mum isn't confident at all in doing it.  I don't think I will have a problem once we're started and I'm sure I will be able to do it single handed but these first few times I'm dreading.....

Monday night is learning how to do the blood from ear or paw.....definitely ear I think as one thing she doesn't like is having her paws touched.

At the moment I'm practising scruffing her and really not doing well - she is just treating it as if I'm giving her cuddles!  Hope she stays like that when she is getting injected twice a day.

Good job I don't have much of a social life but the lie ins at weekend are out the window and her mealtimes have to be slightly adjusted to make sure she is fully fed before she gets her dose.


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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #143 on: September 27, 2016, 21:32:36 PM »
I have had 3 Diabetics, Tiger feral on 3 and 3 units, HRH Princess Sweetie in 2 and 1 and Miss Millie on 5 and 5, we never did home testing with the first one being feral and got them stable and tested at the vets twice a year, we also never changed foods being a multi household not worth the effort and nobody ate the diabetic food, we also used treats to keep them sat in one place for injections and Tiger the feral was a star he got the first one at 7am and was home for his cheese at 7pm everyday

Good luck on your journey x
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Offline Lyn (Slugsta)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #142 on: September 27, 2016, 15:09:20 PM »
No, you're not totally crazy  :evillaugh:

Offline Sootyca

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #141 on: September 27, 2016, 13:48:25 PM »
Daft as it sounds, I'm really relieved. I do trust the vets but was never comfortable with the cruciate ligament diagnosis from the second vet and only went there as the first said it was spinal and untreatable. 

It really does go to show that you should follow instinct even if you think you are neurotic!

I am relieved as it can be treated - yes she will be on medication probably for the rest of her life but she will be treatable and will have a good life once she is stable.  Her kidney levels and liver enzymes were slightly raised but vet isn't concerned on that.  If the diabetes is causing diabetic neuropathy then the hind leg weakness should improve in 6-12 months I think it was.

I want to thank you all for your support and reassuring me I'm not totally crazy!

Offline Lyn (Slugsta)

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Re: Vet trip for Sky :(
« Reply #140 on: September 27, 2016, 13:32:35 PM »
Sorry to hear that your lovely girl has diabetes  :( but very glad that you now have some answers and know what the next steps will be  :)

Diabetes can cause muscle loss/weakness, so that fits the picture.

 


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