Topic: Vet warning re Dry food (Read 8176 times)

Hippykitty · « **Reply #37 on:** May 15, 2007, 09:18:30 AM »

I feed P and S wet food (Whiskas supermeat, chicken variety - they don't like the other flavours or makes) but sprinkle about half a dozen Go Cat on each dish. If I don't put the dry food on top, they go on munchie strike; especially S! But their dry food is strictly limited.

A cat can live happily without teeth - Polly hasn't got any! She sat on my lap one day, years ago, yawned, and I noticed that she'd lost them all. I'm not sure if she had any when I took her in. She manages perfectly well. But if her kidneys went, or she got a serious bladder/kidney infection, I'm not sure she'd survive at her age.

A way to check if puss is dehydrated: pick up the scruff, hold it a couple of seconds, let it go. If it springs back then puss is okay, but if it remains standing, or takes a while to go back down, your cat is dehydrated. This was taught to me by a vet I used to date.

Desley (booktigger) · « **Reply #36 on:** May 12, 2007, 21:20:24 PM »

I think that some cats are prone to things, and that not all probs are diet related - Tom's cystitis was stress related, although his weight didn't help, and he had dry c/d for a while (Samples to see how he liked them) and he still had issues on that, wet and cystaid was best for him (and his weight loss!!)

Mark · « **Reply #35 on:** May 12, 2007, 19:02:31 PM »

Its true!

She was being fed Go Cat by CP but they said it was only because they got it free and they didn't recommend it at all!

Millys Mum · « **Reply #34 on:** May 12, 2007, 18:56:13 PM »

Its the high % of carbs in cheap wet food which causes plaque (carbs turn to sugar) dry food is also high in carbs and has the same effect.
Any type of food that requires minimal chewing will create plaque, its the chewing action that creates saliva and the neccessary enzymes to start the digestion process.

Mark, your Kylie sounds addicted! I bet she would give a paw for a bowl of Go Cat

Mark · « **Reply #33 on:** May 12, 2007, 18:40:33 PM »

My 1st vet in London - Village Vets in North London (recommended by North London CP) told me that wet food sticks to cats teeth "like toffee" and causes them to rot. This may well be true of processed cat food so the raw meat diet seems the way to go. The problm is, getting them to eat it. Kylie doesn't recognise any meat as food - she sniffs it and walks off (and this is a 7kg cat!)

I was discussing giving clapton his forkekor wrapped in ham as its the easiest way but I was worried about the phosophates in it. He said not to worry and there is to much amphasis on diet. He said animals and people would benefit more from 15 minutes of exercise a day than most supplements and fussy eating.

Littlebobo · « **Reply #32 on:** May 12, 2007, 16:17:47 PM »

Nearly all the vets i have spoken to always recommend wet food when i mentioned Kidney problems and obviously things like diabetes they still swore by it which i think is madness i feed a mix of both ...they never get pork though ...ewwwww Pork yuck makes me shudder !

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #31 on:** May 12, 2007, 16:08:15 PM »

It's amazing the lack of knowledge some vets have, although I suppose thinking about it's not really surprising. Vets, like doctors, are mainly taught how to identify and treat disease in a variety of animals and dont' spend a whole lot of time on the preventative, holistic aspect of keeping our pets healthy, including nutrition. Unless a vet has a specific interest in feline nutrition they just repeat what they've been told (mainly by pet food manufacturers!) about food and there was a time when dry food was considered better for their teeth, although now more and more vets are realising that's simply not true. I've never really had a discussion with my vets about nutrition, and I don't really have one regular vet anyway, but I reckon that the amount of time and effort I've put into researchig nutrition is probably a lot more than s/he has spent on the subject, so while I'd bear their advice in mind I wouldn't go with it if I felt it contradicted what I believe in (not talking here about diet for specific medical problems, just diet in general).

Amy · « **Reply #30 on:** May 12, 2007, 15:35:10 PM »

I'm beginning to doubt my vets knowledge now...

When Minty went for his boosters he asked me what food i was feeding as his teeth were "sparkling" and i said a mix of JWB and NM (wet)..
He said not to bother with wet food cus it was bad for their teeth, and would eventually cause problems.
So i said what about crystals and urinary tract infections later on in life, and he said if a cat was prone to these things they would get them anyway, regardless of the food they were being fed..

Needless to say I ignored his advice and have continued feeding a mix..

Mark · « **Reply #29 on:** May 11, 2007, 18:11:54 PM »

One good thing is I never see Iams in vets any more. Has anyone else?
My cat carer in London told the vets in Islington that she wouldn't use or recommend them unless the stopped selling it - they stopped

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #28 on:** May 11, 2007, 18:03:03 PM »

Quote from: Millys Mum on May 11, 2007, 17:45:19 PM

I wonder if there are any practices in the UK that dont reccommend Hills as their best diet....

My vets have never pushed hills. I don't think they stock much but will order in prescription food if needed. When I wanted to try hills t/d for dental care I asked about it and they said they could order me a bag. They don't have any display of food to sell or anything.

Quote from: Millys Mum on May 11, 2007, 17:45:19 PM

Susanne, that parasite you think of is Trichinosis <sp> cooking kills it i believe.

Ah right - thanks. I had a feeling it began with a T!

Millys Mum · « **Reply #27 on:** May 11, 2007, 17:45:19 PM »

Cats get addicted to dry food because of what they spray over it

I wonder if there are any practices in the UK that dont reccommend Hills as their best diet....

Susanne, that parasite you think of is Trichinosis <sp> cooking kills it i believe.

Mark · « **Reply #26 on:** May 10, 2007, 20:28:59 PM »

He is clued up and admits that we know our animals the best. He just said try but make sure he eats. Thats what I am trying to do. I just found out that Hills have started doing a K/D pouch in gravy so I will order some. Its so new, its not even on their website yet. I'm concerned that the k/d has pork in

Must be modified or something. It seems Tesco is his favourite so I will give him a mix of fish/chicken tesco & senior food otherwise.

swampmaxmum · « **Reply #25 on:** May 10, 2007, 17:04:26 PM »

Mark, if you get on well with your vet, he can ring up Hills vets (not the customer service you or I can speak to) and ask them which of their foods may be ok for Clapton and also quiz them about the pork content of the minced chicken - it may be a very tiny amount. It's quite a new product I think? Will possibly replace the old style k/d (?) which is disgusting looking.
Or you can keep him on Tesco jelly or keep on cooking the chicken. Sounds like your vet has got quite a lot clued up than most. Mine just swears by Hills.....

oh btw there is lots of meat in the dry foods methinks :-) not a veggie diet at all.

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #24 on:** May 10, 2007, 12:37:29 PM »

my cats have both wet and dry food !
my max eats a lot ! lot ! more dry than wet though ! he is very fond of his dry food
id never just feed a dry food diet as i feel cats need there meat !

Mark · « **Reply #23 on:** May 10, 2007, 10:04:35 AM »

I think I will stick with the no-pork to be on the safe side. I always opt for fish or chicken type foods anyway.

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #22 on:** May 10, 2007, 10:03:05 AM »

I think the potential problem with pork is that there's a parasite(s) that are more likely to be found in pork? something like that. I wouldn't feed raw pork but at the moment I'm happy to let Mosi have the hi life pork and game pouch (he had some of that last night and enjoyed it!) and the bozita that also contains pork.

Desley (booktigger) · « **Reply #21 on:** May 10, 2007, 08:18:54 AM »

Soaking biscuits really goes against what biscuits are though - incidentally, I have tried it the odd time, and they haven't gone down. And yes, they do then need to be treated like wet food, and not left out for long, dry food is sprayed with fats to make them more appealing, so adding water to that mix encourages bacteria.

Mark · « **Reply #20 on:** May 10, 2007, 08:16:45 AM »

I wonder if they would eat biscuits soaked with water. Clapton sometimes eats the hedgehogs biscuits if it has rained in the night. Somebody (suzananne?) said that wet biscuits have to be eaten within 30 minutes due to bacteria.

Desley (booktigger) · « **Reply #19 on:** May 10, 2007, 08:10:59 AM »

I have read all those reasons before, and agree with them all. I dont like mine having a lot of dry, but they are getting it at the moment, might have to cut down on it, I normally only see Molly drink water when she has dry, but the water level isn't goign down well at the moment, so I might have to rethink that one - she is being picky with her wet at the moment though!!

tinyrosie · « **Reply #18 on:** May 09, 2007, 23:11:19 PM »

i feed rosie mostly wet, she does have dry but only seems to go for this when she wants more food. she just has a few and scatters the rest to make noise so i will feed her. the rescue centre said she was on half and half, but my friend has had problems with dry.
she was told by her vet to give him dry (iams) but he developed quite serious bladder problems and crystals. poor oliver! it took quite a while to get right and then the vet said to put him back on dry food (bought from the vet) but she didnt. he is on mostly wet and is very healthy. the thing is the vet thinks he is on dry and say can she now see why it is better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!..............ive told her to change vets!!
mostly wet for rosie i think.....much to her pleasure

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #17 on:** May 09, 2007, 22:47:30 PM »

Your vet sounds pretty clued up but most vets get next to no nutritional training so aren't anything close to nutrition experts. Which is why I'm always sceptical about nutrition advice from a vet. Some vets still insist that dry food is good for their teeth

I have a rule that if I hear something I need it verified by at least one other source before I will believe it

Mark · « **Reply #16 on:** May 09, 2007, 22:14:40 PM »

I would trust health experts before pet-food giants. No more pork for my cats.

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #15 on:** May 09, 2007, 22:10:06 PM »

I have heard of pork being not the best food for cats before, but tbh it is in quite a few foods (hi life do a pork and game ? pouch, and pork is in bozita) and my cats do ok with it - no problems digesting it.

Mark · « **Reply #14 on:** May 09, 2007, 22:05:14 PM »

Maybe just more honest.

Seriously, I thought he was a show off but it sounds like he knows his stuff. He is a cancer specialist too. He goes up to London to have meetings with the top bods at the society and met ministers for discussions on the welfare bill etc. Also Sharon says he does her CP treatments for next-to-nothing

Gill (sneakiefeline) · « **Reply #13 on:** May 09, 2007, 21:40:40 PM »

More learned than Hill prescription peeps

Mark · « **Reply #12 on:** May 09, 2007, 21:06:56 PM »

He said something to do with large molecules :Crazy

I just googled pork cat molecules

There are quite a few references including the one below

5. not pork (while every meat may potentially carry parasites, etc.,
pork is one of the worst offenders. Additionally, pork fat molecules
are apparently larger than those of other animals, making it hard for
a cat's tiny system to properly process them.)

Also this

http://eat2love.wordpress.com/2007/03/26/pet-food/

The important bit being
*no pork for cats - raw or cooked. this is because the fat molecules in pork are bigger than cats’ capillaries and will clog it.

I think my vet is most learned

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #11 on:** May 09, 2007, 20:08:15 PM »

Quote from: Mark on May 09, 2007, 19:48:16 PM

Another concern is I want clapton to try the new Hill's k/d minced chicken. I checked the ingredients and it contains pork which the vet said is the worse thing possible for a cat with CRF

I'm not totally convinced about that - did he give a reason for why pork is so bad for crf cats? High in phosphorus or something? Tanya's felinecrf.org site doesn't mention anything about avoiding pork, iirc (which I may not!).

Mark · « **Reply #10 on:** May 09, 2007, 19:48:16 PM »

He mentioned the crystals too. (very informative vet we have

)

He said cats have survived for thousands of years without biscuits

Just when I've bought 10kg of science plan

Odd that Hill's sell a dry kidney food (g/d?)

Another concern is I want clapton to try the new Hill's k/d minced chicken. I checked the ingredients and it contains pork which the vet said is the worse thing possible for a cat with CRF

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #9 on:** May 09, 2007, 19:30:25 PM »

I used to feed about half and half but for a while now Jaffa has been on all wet and Mosi is working his way towards all wet too as I agree with those points. Never again will I allow a cat to eat more than a small amount of dry food (and only then for the convenience factor). I've read quite a few articles by vets saying similar things. It's seems a bit daft to me take moisture out of food then move heaven and earth to get that water back into the cat. Studies have shown that cats fed on exclusively dry food take in less water overall and have more concentrated urine which many vets consider to be responsible for urinary problems such as crystals. There was a recent article in one of the cat mags by holistic vet Richard Allport blaming dry food for diabetes.

But of course it's not always as simple as that and some cats wont eat wet food. I would always suggest some wet food in the diet if the cat will eat it.

JackSpratt · « **Reply #8 on:** May 09, 2007, 19:19:38 PM »

Mine used to be on a dry food only diet, but as they've got older I feel they need the moisture in the meat. So they get both now.

Gill (sneakiefeline) · « **Reply #7 on:** May 09, 2007, 19:09:39 PM »

Misa likes one mouthful of dry and then a mouthful of wet and they eat Felix wet pouches cos thats all they will eat

Angiew · « **Reply #6 on:** May 09, 2007, 19:07:37 PM »

Its why it important to try and give them a good quality dy food.

mine love whishas and go-cat but are banned and have to make do with the JWB!

Gill (sneakiefeline) · « **Reply #5 on:** May 09, 2007, 19:03:07 PM »

Mine eat wet and dry but they seem very partial to the dry

Dawn (DiddyDawn) · « **Reply #4 on:** May 09, 2007, 18:50:56 PM »

I feed mine wet and dry but I have found quite a few of them do prefer the dry which surprised me. The dehydration side of things, I would go along with..........all mine have free access to water and nearly every blood test I've had done, they have been slightly dehydrated even the dog results yesterday and she does drink an awful lot of water

Gillian Harvey · « **Reply #3 on:** May 09, 2007, 18:46:54 PM »

Quote from: Mark on May 09, 2007, 18:41:21 PM

My vet said that someone (somebody Sparks I think) has written a veterinary medical paper claiming that dry food is to blame for a lot of cat illness, especially kidney problems,. He has proven that cats fed exclusively dry food are clinically dehydrated.. The vet said its cheaper to make than wet food, cheaper to ship and they can add all knds of nasties. He doesn't approve of a dry diet. He said dry food is fine for young healthy cats but as they get older or get sick, thats when the problems start.

Yep, thats true, (is it Andrew Sparks?) - dry food doesnt have enough moisture (about 10% compared to about 80% for wet) and even though cats drink a lot of water when eating dry food, its never enough to compensate. Dry food can also lead to dental probs and urinary probs - as I found out with mine. Its why I changed to a wet food diet/raw meat diet.

ccmacey · « **Reply #2 on:** May 09, 2007, 18:46:34 PM »

I don't think a cat should be fed only dry food anyway, I mean come on they don't go around eating biscuits in the wild they are carnivores.

Mark · « **Reply #1 on:** May 09, 2007, 18:41:21 PM »

My vet said that someone (somebody Sparks I think) has written a veterinary medical paper claiming that dry food is to blame for a lot of cat illness, especially kidney problems,. He has proven that cats fed exclusively dry food are clinically dehydrated.. The vet said its cheaper to make than wet food, cheaper to ship and they can add all knds of nasties. He doesn't approve of a dry diet. He said dry food is fine for young healthy cats but as they get older or get sick, thats when the problems start.

Author Topic: Vet warning re Dry food (Read 8176 times)

ccmacey