Massive dilemma

[Kucinta]

Will the rescue lady let you know when [the former] Roxy has her kittens?

[Catjane]

What do you guys think of my cunning plan? 

Excellent idea - I doubt she will care about someone else's situation though. You haven't got  dodgy old bottle of sherry at the back of the cupboard have you? - I'm sure she would go for that! 

Sadly no, Mark - I drank it all myself! 

[Catjane]

Glad that Roxy is safe, really hope that chav and chavette find something else to focus their tiny minds on so you don't need to worry about the safety of your own cats 

I know it's not a laughing matter but your posts had me wetting myself, first chavette, then chav, then 'let's call her scrounger' 

It's a lovely neighbourhood here, really it is!  Honestly, Chavette is in serious need of dentistry and a kick up the backside!  I was saying to someone in a PM that she's always lying through her teeth, but she can't really cause she doesn't have any left, they all fell out with the strain!

So far she hasn't contacted me, and my cats are all fine   I think they're very relieved that they don't have to constantly contend with poor old Roxy coming into the house to eat their food, Shanti especially.  I've noticed a change in her - before when I opened the cat flap in the morning she'd huff and be on edge and seemingly in a bad mood, keen to check her territory, every morning.  But for the last few days she's been much more patient and relaxed about going out first thing in the morning.  So there's a bonus for Shanti, bless her 

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

I would run with your idea 

I love the names cos we all know who we are talking about 

[Tiggy's Mum]

Glad that Roxy is safe, really hope that chav and chavette find something else to focus their tiny minds on so you don't need to worry about the safety of your own cats 

I know it's not a laughing matter but your posts had me wetting myself, first chavette, then chav, then 'let's call her scrounger' 

[Mark]

What do you guys think of my cunning plan? 

Excellent idea - I doubt she will care about someone else's situation though. You haven't got  dodgy old bottle of sherry at the back of the cupboard have you? - I'm sure she would go for that! 

[Catjane]

Yeah, kinda

I rationalised that until she gets an answer from me, she's not going to do anything to my cats.  I also decided that, like her, I wouldn't bother to do the running as it isn't in my interests to do so, so I'll wait for her to pursue it as I said to her to speak to Chav and let me know what he says whilst in the meantime I'd speak to the rescue.  So really the ball's in her court, and it's not like I've refused to play ball (yet).  Then if and when she presses me for some money I'll lay a massive guilt trip on her which may or may not work ... it's a bit naughty, but I'm going to say as the rescue'a a charity they desperately need money and can't give any away, and perhaps she'd like to donate for Roxy's care?  And if that doesn't shut her up, I'll say, well, if the money is so important to you I'll give you a little out of my own pocket, but as I'm really skint at the moment I've had to borrow if off my best friend (who she knows is disabled).  I'll also ask her if she feels that's the right thing to do without labouring the point.  Maybe it'll work, maybe it won't.  It's a bit below the belt, but I don't think she deserves any better.

What do you guys think of my cunning plan? 

[AliCat]

Have you decided what you are going to do yet?

x

[JackSpratt]

whatever the rights and wrongs, I do understand you can't live in fear of your neighbour

I must say if it were me, and £20 was sure to bring an end to any unpleasantness, now or in the future, I would pay it

it would be morally repugnant, and unfair, but I would consider it a small price to pay for my cats' wellbeing, and my own peace of mind

I agree entirely with this statement. Much as I HATE the idea that these "people" are making any money from basically neglecting their cat to the point where someone has to step in, protecting your cats is always going to be first and foremost. Sadly, although Mark and Gills points are indeed valid, logical and should in theory work, the individuals you're dealing with don't sound any of  those things.....

[jezebel]

For what it's worth, I agree with the others that you shouldn't give her any money.

If you start handing out cash, trust me - it won't end there. If she thinks she can intimidate or guilt trip you into giving her money, she'll carry on doing it.

Anyhow, as far as she's concerned, you don't have any money - this is why you had to hand Roxy over to the rescue for urgent medical attention!

[Fire Fox]

I don't think you should threaten anything, you should continue to be your usual helpful and caring self as they won't be accustomed to that with their attitude. 

Would you prefer to deal with Chav or Chavette? Decide which (not both) and invite them in for a cup of tea, a few biscuits and a chat. I agree with offering to facilitate a meeting with the fosterer, assuming the fosterer would be happy to make the same 'expensive vets bills' story. If worst comes to worst you can offer to write a cheque to Chav - people on benefits are not supposed to have undeclared additional income.

[Kay and Penny]

whatever the rights and wrongs, I do understand you can't live in fear of your neighbour

I must say if it were me, and £20 was sure to bring an end to any unpleasantness, now or in the future, I would pay it

it would be morally repugnant, and unfair, but I would consider it a small price to pay for my cats' wellbeing, and my own peace of mind

[Catjane]

Thanks Gill - there is a 'yes' in there unfortunately - they all go in her garden, although only Shanti spends any time in there, but she even goes in her house when the kids aren't there.  That's why I'm worried that she could be 'kidnapped'.  She's not threatened any of my cats to my knowledge, though.  But you say pretty much what my dad has just said, he doesn't think I should hand over any money either, in fact he said do the sort of thing she'd understand ... threaten to bring in the heavies!  I couldn't do that though, I'm not the sort of person to be able to carry it off convincingly.

If I do give her money, it will be in exchange for a proper receipt for Roxy.

I'll consider all the options everyone's suggested and hopefully things will look a bit clearer in the morning.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Its so hard to be calm and unfearing when you are so close to the problem 

I know this cos am terrified of my neighbour and he has an air rifle and has threaten to shoot my cats, they are certainly scared of him and the sound of his car or lorry coming up the back makes them run for the flap 

Obvioulsy I dont know your living situation but has she ever attempted to harm your cats before? Has she threatened them recently?, Do they go in her garden?

If all answers are no, then I reckon your cats will be OK.

If there is a yes in there, then you need to be careful and aware and maybe report her to the police if she is making threats.

I wish we could come round and give her a real shock and to show her that you have loads of support, I really hope that things are OK and dont think you should give her money cos its blackmail and she could keep asking 

[Catjane]

Gill - that's great logic, and sounds awesome when you put it like that!  It makes so much sense to do what you suggest, but my underlying fear is that if I don't hand over some cash Chavette will do something awful to my purrballs, and I couldn't bear that   Meesh & Sabby will be alright as they don't like other humans much and won't let her get near enough, but Shanti is super-sociable and unfortunately isn't very discriminating in her choice of acquaintances.  I'll probably have bad dreams about all this tonight!

[Rosella moggy]

Can only reiterrate Gill/ Mark/Pudding's posts and send you many 

[Pudding]

I agree with Gill, keep it simple, stick to your story, which is based on fact, and DO NOT HAND OVER ANY MONEY. Does Roxy look anything like a long haired cat, ver mind a persian

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Do not speak to Scrounger, the more people you involve the more complicated it will get and the more to gang up on you.

Use the KISS principle ( Keep It Simple Stupid) , not implying that you are but its a well known acronym  and the Chav family do appear to fall into this category 

I think Marks idea is the way to go but do not approach anyone else at all, if any of the Chav family approach you,,,,,,,,,,you say medical bills are £200 and the rescue would only give up Roxy on production of that amount and the Chavs would have to pay it and sign up to get her back, saying they agree to look after Roxy as per the Animal Welfare Act, which means well fed and looked after and medical attention when she needed it, vaccinations, neutering and chipping plus an annual health check and vaccination boosters. She would also have to provide the name and address of a vet who she has registered with and the rescue would check up to see if these things have been done.

Stick to your version and dont get involved with arguements with any of Chavs.

I would mention this to the Rescue lady so she knows what you have said and that she can spin the same tale..................I dont think there is anyway that Chavs will fork out £200.

If Chav says you have taken their cat you just say thats not true and she gave you Roxy............or what ever happened............but you then found that Roxy needed urgent medical attention and you could not afford it. So yesterday you went round to Chav to ask them if they had the money but nobody would answer the door, so as you also could not afford Roxys treatment you were forced to sign her over to a rescue who would look after her. Tell her that if you had not done this you would have been prosecuted under the Animal Welfare Act as she would have been.

Point out to her that the RSPCA are now taking peolpe to court for not looking after their cats and when they do they win every time!

[Catjane]

Yeah, I think I will speak to Scrounger when I think that Chavette's not in, otherwise she'll be at my door demanding to know what I went over there for (we can easily see each other's front doors).

I spoke to my best friend who suggested that I give her £20 and be done with it, because £20 is worth eliminating the massive stress I'm feeling about it and the worry that she'll do something dreadful to my cats.  In fact, he even offered to pay it himself, but I won't have that as he's as strapped for cash as I am, bless him.  But he has a point, I suppose, but I balk at the idea of giving Chavette any money at all when she's such a freeloader.

I'll sleep on it, but I don't feel comfortable letting my cats out at the moment in case she tries for revenge or kidnaps Shanti (the other two wouldn't go anywhere near her) to sell her or something.  I wouldn't put it past her.  My poor kitties, they've had to put up with months of defending their home against Roxy because Chavette doesn't feed her properly, then they have to contend with Roxy actually living in close proximity to them, and now they can't go out!!

[Kucinta]

I'm sorry to hear that Chavette is playing up, and Mark's suggestion sounds like a plan.

I find it hard to believe either Chav or Chavette would fork out £70 for a cat, even if they had planned to use it as a kitten/money making machine.

Are you on speaking terms with Scrounger, to check out the sums involved and calll their bluff? Sounds like Scrounger might just have been glad to get shot of Roxy for nowt if she was feisty enough to defend herself.

Given the conditions Roxy has been kept in and the fact that the foster lady thought birth was imminent, Roxy's poor (and reportable) state of health might mean none of the kittens be expected to survive birth anyway...

I can't see Chavette passsing any dosh onto Chav anyway - suspect she's just trying it on for herself.

Sorry you're getting so much grief for doing the right thing.

[Mark]

  You could tell her that so far, the vet bills amount to X and they will need to settle it before Roxy is handed back, as vet bills aren't paid by the rescue for owned cats - if she says she wouldn't have had the treatment done, tell her in that case, she would have been reported to the RSPCA as it is a legal requirement to give any necessary vet treatment. I know it is all getting complicated  - maybe the rescue woman has some ideas. It sounds like with those 2, Roxy would be going into the frying pan or the fire 

[Catjane]

Thanks peeps!

Unfortunately it's not over yet

As I was leaving my house earlier and about to put my note through her door, Chavette was just leaving hers, so she had no option but to speak to me.  I told her what had happened, and suddenly she brought her ex-partner, Chav, into it.  She said 'Chav's not going to be very happy about that, he wants Roxy back'.  Now she has told me several times that Chav is dying of cancer, although like everything else that comes out of her mouth it's probably not true.  He seemed pretty healthy to me when he came to collect his daughter to live with him yesterday, although I could be mistaken, of course.  And she has never, at any point, suggested that Roxy was Chav's cat.  What I do know about Roxy is that they got her off one of my other neighbours (let's call her Scrounger) because she was 'attacking her kids'.  So anyway, I said to her that if I'd known Roxy was Chav's cat, I would have spoken to him, not Chavette.  I also pointed out to her that, sad as it is, it wouldn't be fair to move Roxy to Chav's flat when he's only got a few months to live.  I asked her what would happen to Roxy after that and she said 'oh, we'd sort that out at the time'.  I said it wasn't fair on Roxy for her to have to move from pillar to post all the time. 

Then the truth reared its ugly head.  Chavette reiterated that Chav would be angry if he didn't get Roxy back as 'he paid 70 quid for her'.  I said 'nobody pays £70 for a cat!' and she said, 'well Scrounger said she was Persian' and I said she's not persian, she's no more persian than I am!  Anyway, the short and long of it is, she wants money for Roxy 

I just said that she should speak to Chav about it, and that in the meantime I'd talk to the foster lady, but I didn't know if there'd be any way to get Chav reimbursed for his (mythical) outlay, and even if there was, it wouldn't be £70!  To which she replied, 'oh I don't expect that much'.

So it's all about the money    I suppose she realised that she wasn't going to get any money for the kittens, and decided she'd have money for Roxy instead.  The thing is, before she'd told me that Chav wanted one of the kittens when it was born, and now she's saying he doesn't want one of the kittens, he wants Roxy.  It'll all a pack of lies, and I'd pretty much ignore if I wasn't so worried that she might try to take it out on me (probably through my cats).

I'll phone the foster lady later and explain the situation, but I don't think there's anything she can do, and I wouldn't expect her to.  I've thought about it and might say to Chavette that sure, she can have some money for Roxy, if she or Chav can provide proof of ownership, because pedigree cats always have documentation, don't they?  I don't know - I'm at my wits' end.

[Pudding]

 

Congratulations. You have just completed your first rescue.

[Desley (booktigger)]

Good on you for helping, and I am glad Roxy will be safe and not have to have any more babies.

[AllShookUp]

You did the right thing  Roxy is safe now. xxx

[Mark]

Good luck - sounds like you did the right thing and I doubt you will hear any more on the subject. I feel sorry for the kids as you know how they will end up.

[Catjane]

Well, I tried, I really did!

Went round to Chavette's this morning, knocked on her door, and shortly after one of the kids shouted through 'Who is it'?' so I told him, the I heard Chavette's voice saying something, the kid's standing just the other side of the door, and then she shouts at him to 'get away from the f**king door!'

What more can I do?  I bet she thinks I'm on her case to get some money for food.  So anyway, I've written her a long note explaining what's happened, playing up the worms issue and saying that Roxy will need treatment for the rest of her life (which of course, she will - every cat does!).  She won't want that expense, now will she?   It was a very friendly note, I might add, one that I hope is likely to elicit relief rather than animosity, but we'll see. 

So hopefully there won't be any repercussions,

[JackSpratt]

Only just read this - well done for helping the little one. (I always think - new name, new start too. )

Good luck talking to your neighbour.

[Yvonne]

Well done hope Roxy is ok and good luck with your neighbour

[AliCat]

Just caught up with this. Good luck for tomorrow! Fingers crossed she won't give you any hassle. Now to liberate the rest...

[Kucinta]

That's brilliant news CJ!

Well done you. 

[Mark]

 

Well done Jane 

Good luck with Chavette - hopefully she will have washed her hands of Roxy. Funnily enough, one of our fosterers is called Roxy 

Glad that it hasn't upset her. She is probably happy to be in the warm with a comfortable bed and a full belly 

[Catjane]

Right - well that's Roxy safe and sound

She's with a lovely foster lady, who has loads of cats and kittens - all absolutely gorgeous!  I could barely tear myself away!  She should be very well looked after there, and it's a lovely clean environment, so I feel like I've done the right thing   When I left she seemed quite happy and relaxed, I'm glad to say.  The foster lady told me that she thinks that Roxy's birth is imminent 

We're going to re-name Roxy as well, new life, new identity!

I'll let you know how I get on with Chavette when I tell her tomorrow 

[jezebel]

What a horrible dilemma. Catjane, I really admire you for doing all this - and for not losing it with Chavette (I wouldn't have been able to keep my temper around her.

It's such a shame that chavettes can't be neutered!

[Mark]

I still think the option should be there as a last resort for Roxy's sake. I certainly wouldn't offer her money - I just can't bear the idea of her going back to living outside and being thrown the odd scrap to eat. 

[Pudding]

Possesion is 9/10ths of the law  Take Roxy to the rescue as soon as you can  and NEVER hand over any money. It mat be hard but if you do that now it's only encourgaing her.

 

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Purrrrrrrrrsonally I think that as she will not answer the door, she has lost interst now and because she will not answer the door Roxy who needed urgent medical treatment has had to go somewhere where she can get it, so now Chavette has lost any options she had cos the cat had to be signed over and she wasnt there to do it.

So the long and the short of it is Chavette Roxy has moved on and you dont have to ummmmmmm worry any more!

I would not try to contact Chavette again and if she approaches you and does not accept the above, then tell her you will ask RSPCA to come round and see her over Roxys bad care under the Anumal Welfare Act...............that should shut her up!

[Kucinta]

If Chavette becomes really unreasonable and is after a payout, I'm sure a few of us can chip in as a one-off.

Much as I hate the idea of that woman making anything out of Roxy, I would certainly be happy to make a contribution if it looked like it would stop things turning nasty. Fingers crossed Madam will just be happy to be relieved of the responsibility, not to mention those enormous vets bills...

 

I don't like the idea, but money talks (it also buys fags & booze) - it would have to be made clear it was a one-off.

I agree with you it might be the pragmatic way to go if Chavette does raise a real stink, as CJ does have to live next door to her; I hope it doesn't come to that though.

I also hope Chavette doesn't acquire any more pets (I don't mean with the money  - as you say, booze etc would be more her style).

[Mark]

If Chavette becomes really unreasonable and is after a payout, I'm sure a few of us can chip in as a one-off.

Much as I hate the idea of that woman making anything out of Roxy, I would certainly be happy to make a contribution if it looked like it would stop things turning nasty. Fingers crossed Madam will just be happy to be relieved of the responsibility, not to mention those enormous vets bills...

 

I don't like the idea, but money talks (it also buys fags & booze) - it would have to be made clear it was a one-off.

[Kucinta]

If Chavette becomes really unreasonable and is after a payout, I'm sure a few of us can chip in as a one-off.

Much as I hate the idea of that woman making anything out of Roxy, I would certainly be happy to make a contribution if it looked like it would stop things turning nasty. Fingers crossed Madam will just be happy to be relieved of the responsibility, not to mention those enormous vets bills...