Halloween Kitten - Ruby has given birth

[Ellen2010]

... yes, and toms can still produce semen up to 6 weeks after castration. 

people say this all the time but is it so? if they ain't got any testes, surely they can't produce any and sperm doen't live very long.....

The male has an area where the sperm is stored and matures outside the testicles and this is not removed during castration so yes it is possible.

thanks, didn't remember that from a level biology!

Not to worry have studied animal anatomy and physiology although a few years ago now

[Lindsey (thefunkyinuit)]

Ooooo I didn't know about the sperm thing! 
No need to worry about any more accidental pregnancies though, although he isn't being neutered until tomorrow and the issue of the 6 weeks after sperm production, Azzy and Ruby have not, and will not be left together unattended (until Ruby has been spayed - just in case!) 
I did tell Azzy off last night because he sniffed Ruby's behind - I said 'Don't you dare!!!' 

[Angiew]

... yes, and toms can still produce semen up to 6 weeks after castration. 

people say this all the time but is it so? if they ain't got any testes, surely they can't produce any and sperm doen't live very long.....

The male has an area where the sperm is stored and matures outside the testicles and this is not removed during castration so yes it is possible.

thanks, didn't remember that from a level biology!

[Ellen2010]

... yes, and toms can still produce semen up to 6 weeks after castration. 

people say this all the time but is it so? if they ain't got any testes, surely they can't produce any and sperm doen't live very long.....

The male has an area where the sperm is stored and matures outside the testicles and this is not removed during castration so yes it is possible. 

[Angiew]

... yes, and toms can still produce semen up to 6 weeks after castration. 

people say this all the time but is it so? if they ain't got any testes, surely they can't produce any and sperm doen't live very long.....

[Ellen2010]

Females can be spayed as soon as the milk has dried up after a kitten has stopped feeding from her which may mean keeping the kitten once it is 8 weeks old seperated from Ruby.

[Steff - Petsearch Bedford HQ]

Ladies...Lindsey did say Azzy is going for the chop tomorrow morning *shy*

Still risky as Julie pointed out though...fingers crossed there won't be any more accidents...as cute as they are.

How soon can females be spayed after having a litter? Is it a soon as the kittens have stopped feeding? So around 5 weeks?? That will be handy info for Lindsey to pass on to her sister

[Pinkbear (Julie)]

... yes, and toms can still produce semen up to 6 weeks after castration. 

[Susanne (urbantigers)]

Oh bless, what a little sweetie!  I quite like Oliver as a name. 

I think I'm going to have to get another cat just so that I can call him Pumpkin!  Sam's little ginger visitor wasnt allowed to keep his Pumpkin and now Pumpkin #2 isn't going to remain Pumpkin either!

Glad kitten is doing well has Azzy had the chop yet?

Yes, any progress on that front?  I hope your sister is aware that cats can go into heat again very quickly after giving birth so if she's not careful poor Ruby will end up pregnant again.

[Liz]

Glad kitten is doing well has Azzy had the chop yet?

[Lindsey (thefunkyinuit)]

Hi everyone, quick update and new pic!

Kitten is still as yet unnamed, Sis's OH doesn't like Pumpkin, Sis now wants to call him Oliver but her OH isn't sure on that one either! 

Hes doing really well, nice 'n' plump and healthy, Ruby is the best mumcat i've ever seen, shes loving being a mummy 

Azzy has chilled out abit regarding being scared of his offspring! Hes still a bit jumpy when he makes noises but has groomed him e.t.c and is friends with Ruby again. Hes booked in for his neuter tommorrow morning.

I had a cuddle with the little man last night, heres a new pic (apologies for the bad lighting, I had to shade the flash so as not to scare/blind him!) -

[Ellen2010]

Kittens in the same litter can actually have different fathers as well as they are reflex ovulators which means eggs are released by doing the act and not like a dog or human which have cycles.

[Skiddaw]

Blimey- I'd never thought of our Munchkin as a male tortie! It is a very tiny patch of black fur, mind- does that still count?

[Ann Clarke (Tabby cat)]

The litter that Luna came from had her - a ginger and white female, a ginger and white boy, calico girl and tortie/tabbie girl so a bit of a mix. Their mum was mainly white with tortie patches and from Lottie's post I assume dad was ginger.

Hobbes' litter had 3 ginger and white boys (one long haired), a calico girl and an all black girl. Mum was a brindle tortie and goodness knows what dad was 

We don't get many ginger females round here but we've certainly had more in the last couple of years.

It's fascinating really all this genetics stuff.

[Pinkbear (Julie)]

We had two males torties born in our care last year. Pudding fostered them. 

We're actually finding the ginger female/male ratio are working out nearly even round here in the last couple of years. We had a ginger/ginger and white litter a couple of years ago and the pure gingers were all female. (think there were 3 or 4 of them) The two born with patches of white were the only male ones. 

[Ellen2010]

My goodness he is a male tortie then and thats very very rare 

Most definately rare a male tortie is about 1 in 300 that are male so treasure him dearly.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

My goodness he is a male tortie then and thats very very rare 

[Skiddaw]

That's facinating! Wish I knew more about it.

Our boy is ginger & white, but has a tiny smudge of black fur on the back of his neck. I'd love to know what his parents looked like.

Pumpkin is gorgeous by the way!!

[Ellen2010]

Genetics also have to do with alleles hence why if you get a white cat with blue eyes they are generally deaf as the alleles for both these are close on the chain.  Colouring is to do with the red allele being turned on or off.

The supposedly least agressive cat is supposed to be an all black cat (dark brown as no true black cat) as the aggressive allele is close in the chain to the aggressive allele and in the black cat the red and aggressive allele are normally turned off. 

Hence why the reputation of a tortie being one of the most aggressive of the cat colours as the aggressive allele as well as the red allele will be turned on in the chain.

Colouring is to do a lot with DNA that is the cat it is a bit like us to dark haired people with brown eyes can give birth to a blonde haired and blue eyed baby depending on what is in our genetics

[Dawn F]

wish I could get to grips with this lottie, I even got a book but find it really hard going!

[Lottie (Team Svartalfheim's)]

I was told by a vet if all ginger will definately be male 

PMSL! (at the vet not at you) Ahhh I love it when vets pretend to know what they are on about with genetics when most of them don't have a clue   My ex stud cats breeder specialised in the red series (red, tortie, cream, blue tortie) colours and she bred an awful lot of red (and cream) females some of whom went on to be breeding queens so were most certainly not male!

As Pumpkin is not dilute (ie he is red not cream) I was discounting the effect of the dilute gene as this would make no difference to whether he was male or female as if he was cream he would still defiantely be a male with the colours of his parents.

[Ellen2010]

Genetics looking at the colours of Ruby and Azzy. With these colour parents all male kittens would be red and all females would be torties.  You can only get red girls if either both parents are red or Mummy is tortie and Daddy is red.

I was told by a vet if all ginger will definately be male if it has white on possibility of male.  As for genetics it depends on parents and older generations colourings as this will decide coat length, eye colour and markings as if both parents have the recessive gene and this is the gene that both parents carry in their DNA then the kitten can have that colour it does not matter what colour the parents are.

[Lindsey (thefunkyinuit)]

Genetics looking at the colours of Ruby and Azzy. With these colour parents all male kittens would be red and all females would be torties.  You can only get red girls if either both parents are red or Mummy is tortie and Daddy is red.

Wow! Thats amazing! My gut feeling was that its a boy  (Also I think if it is a boy she will keep the name Pumpkin - which I LOVE! But if its a girl she wants to call it Peaches because thats the name she wanted to give Ruby at the time but her OH won and got his way with her name)
Thanks for that, i'm gonna go send her a message to tell her!   

[Lottie (Team Svartalfheim's)]

Genetics looking at the colours of Ruby and Azzy. With these colour parents all male kittens would be red and all females would be torties.  You can only get red girls if either both parents are red or Mummy is tortie and Daddy is red.

[JackSpratt]

There is only one kitten though and my sister has decided to keep it (I say 'it' because we don't know if its a girl or boy yet!)

Pumpkin is a little boy 

Blimey! How did you get that from those piccies?

[Lottie (Team Svartalfheim's)]

So sorry to hear of the two kittens that died  I am however glad that your sister will be getting Azzy and Ruby neutered asap and then Pumpkin too when he is old enough.

Lovely pictures of little Pumpkin, what a sweetie he is.

[Lottie (Team Svartalfheim's)]

There is only one kitten though and my sister has decided to keep it (I say 'it' because we don't know if its a girl or boy yet!)

Pumpkin is a little boy 

[Susanne (urbantigers)]

It's very sad that 2 of the kittens died, but at least your sister has seen the downside of letting her cat have kittens and experienced the heartbreak of losing them.  If that ensures she always neuters her cats in future, then at least some good has come out of it.

[blackcat]

Well Done Lindsey - and sorry for the numerical error - I am in the middle of a chicken hatching that has not gone to plan either, so got a little confused (it being early morning here when I posted). Great to hear she has had a major reversal in attitude. You deserve a long hot bubbly bath as a reward methinks!!

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Well done Lindsay and isnt it sad how a tragedy has had to happen to bring her round. At least she is there now and maybe will also spread this around her friends 

[Lindsey (thefunkyinuit)]

It sounds like you hvae done an excellent job in re-educating your sister. Well done you! Now the hard part starts with ensuring that all the kittens go to the sort of home that will ensure they are neutered. I wonder if your local CP can provide neutering vouchers to go with each kitten to its new home? Perhaps your sister could offer a donation in exchange for the vouchers.

Thank you 
There is only one kitten though and my sister has decided to keep it (I say 'it' because we don't know if its a girl or boy yet!) But with regards to neutering when its old enough, she mentioned it even before I had a chance to so I think I've finally got through to her!
My sister's friends are going to be quite disappointed though as they had their heart set on having one of the kittens but having tragically lost 2, my sis feels she can't part with Pumpkin! At least it gives a rescue kitten a chance for a home now 

[blackcat]

It sounds like you hvae done an excellent job in re-educating your sister. Well done you! Now the hard part starts with ensuring that all the kittens go to the sort of home that will ensure they are neutered. I wonder if your local CP can provide neutering vouchers to go with each kitten to its new home? Perhaps your sister could offer a donation in exchange for the vouchers.

[Teresa Pawcats]

T I love looking at all the pics in rescue and re-homing then feel guilty because I cant have one 
love
Tab

Tab I know you do  I was just shocked to learn that some of the posters liked pictures 

[Ellen2010]

I am so glad that the owners have decided to have both parents done ASAP.  I never commented before as wanted to stay out of the controversy.  I also hope they find a responsible home for Pumpkin or get him neutered when he is old enough to be done if they are keeping him.

When I read one was called Domino I had to go and check my boy to make sure he was ok, such a shame that Domino and Pizza never made it.

 RIP little ones and play hard on the Bridge.

[tab]

Very cute and although Im really glad mum and Dad will be done now what a sad way to get the point accross.

T I love looking at all the pics in rescue and re-homing then feel guilty because I cant have one 
love
Tab

[JackSpratt]

Definitely - there are some adorable kittens on the Paws Inn site, as well as most of the other rescues.

Lindsey, Azzy and Ruby are stunning cats. And Pumpkin is a cutie.

(I agree that getting Azy to the vets for his neuter ASAP is a good plan. It's a lot more of a simple op for males and if it's funds that are stopping the neuter being done this week your sister can call the CP and they'll send a voucher to reduce costs. )

[Teresa Pawcats]

I truly hope that this kitten has a long, happy life.

May I point out to all those who have posted that they like to look at pictures that there are lots of beautiful kittens in Rescue/Rehoming that people dont seem to know about, perhaps because they have not caused so much controversy ?

[Liz]

So sorry that 2 of the kittens died

Can I suggest that she gets the male booked in like tomorrow one phone call to the vet is all that is needed and I'm sure that a voucher can be got if there are are any money worries so this can be stopped now

Vets take males at very little notice - as they are used to dealing with trapped cats at no notice as trapping isn't an exact science so a nice male is a bonus!

[clarenmax]

Its hard to imagine all our furkids were once that small!!!!

Glad little one is doing well, and so pleased that they have agreed to get mum and dad 'done' as soon as they can be 

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]