Do rescues/shelter charge too much for their animals?

[blackcat]

Yes, the price tag approach would be good - particularly for those animals whose bills run to the £1000s. But finish off with  - price £60.00. The total cost, even for a kitten born at the rescue is far higher than the actual £££ as the time of the volunteer foster carer is not factored in, nor is the food costs if the volunteer chooses to pay that out of their own pocket.

[miranda luck]

I agree it is an educational process - but do people read leaflets? 

Now don't go mad at me people because I am not suggesting animals are or should be compared to products on a store shelf BUT how about putting a 'price-tag' on individual pens.

Ie: Monty (and all the normal details)
PLUS:  Vaccination £18
           Flea tx        £8
           Chip           £5
           Dental        £89
           Neuter       £18
           BT              £20
           total          £158



It would certainly get attention!

[Mark]

I don't think it is Miranda's own point of view but was an unintentionally leading question. I really don't understand why she is getting so much grief 

As for CP, up until now, donations have been voluntary and can be anything from £100+ to a tin of cat food (yes really!) - I believe Julie was given a bag of cabbages or similar once  - As from October, CP will be charging a fixed fee (with some flexibility). I'm not sure if this will work, but they have worked out that it won't have a negative impact on revenue.

I do think that people think organisations like CP have endless reserves. We sometimes have people asking if they are 'entitled' to money to pay vet bills etc. 

There is a rescue in Essex - I can't remember the name offhand, but they charge a set price for cats/kittens and the prices varies depending on age/colour - that I think is really odd 

[blackcat]

So it is an educational process that is required then. I think a lot of people going to a rescue for an animal will assume that they are doing the rescue a favour - and the animal, in that they are providing a home for an unwanted animal. To be met with a charge can be off-putting in that context. So perhaps each rescue needs to prepare a booklet that outlines the costs involved in the work in an objective and business-like manner to ensure that people who may already be feeling 'had' can see that they are dealing with people whose expenses are not being met by the contribution they are making in £££ terms.

Just saying 'it costs a lot' or 'we are barely making ends meet' is not sufficient to the case. There are so many organisations out there dealing with heart-wrenching issues - child abuse, illnesses of various sorts, starving kiddies in Africa etc, that an appeal solely to the heart can not necessarily achieve the outcome sought.

[miranda luck]

"There is more than just money involved here there is the time and patience of all of us to show the animal what love and true care is and to make sure they are going to a good and loving home".

I absolutely agree and I'm sure others do to.

But just to put things into context - on another (predominately pet ownership) forum, one of the members has suggested that no only do rescues charge too much - but "why don't they provide lifelong medical cover as well".  (!!!??!! I can hear your cries of laughter/tears now!)

Also - the general consensus (on that site) is that the rescues are charging to much.  They say things like I can get an animal from the paper/shop etc for much cheaper.

They clearly do not know/appreciate the costs and the fact that they are actually wrong in their assumptions.

 

[Ellen2010]

Miranda I have been fostering and involved in rescue also for over 20 years.

I have fostered for several rescues and have found that there is no way that they can recouperate the cost that the animal has incurred.  If that was the case if you take blood tests, neutering, food, cat litter, flea treatments, worming treatments, veterinary costs (medication and consultations), shelter (light and heating) for the animals it would work out dearer than what you would pay for some pedigree animals.  Then on top of that they have the cleaning costs as after each cat or dog leaves a pen it has to be thoroughly disinfected with a good high quality disinfectant before another animal can occupy that space.  Also some animals maybe referred to behaviourists as they have been that badly treated to help in recovery of the animal and make it possible for them to home.

Many fosterers if fostering at home actually dip in to their own pockets for things such as toys, bedding and treats for the animals which do not come out of rescue funds at all.

So with your question it strikes me that it is just demeaning what the people on this site are doing by asking do rescues charge too much.  There is more than just money involved here there is the time and patience of all of us to show the animal what love and true care is and to make sure they are going to a good and loving home.

[miranda luck]

'You will get a one sided argument on this site as most people who are on here are either in rescue of support what rescues do'.

Ahhh I see. Thanks for letting me know.  And interesting comments about the re-sale of pedigrees.  I had heard that it had/was happening through the grapevine but had yet to hear first hand.

I think the CP sign is an excellent idea. It would be good to get the up to date costs and get one of the big companies to produce/sponsor a poster to that effect for reception areas. 

I know people will say - if potential adopters are being 'funny' about the price, then how will they feel about vet bills etc but people are funny about money and like to think they are getting value for money.

[Angiew]

You will get a one sided argument on this site as most people who are on here are either in rescue of support what rescues do.

I ask more for a pedigree cat, not because they are worth more in my eyes, but because unless the person is known as as good sort, I have learnt to distrust most people and I'm not going to hand over a pedigree cat to someone for £50 and then see one up for sale on the free ads for £200+. We do home visits and assess potential owners but I am well aware that if someone is out to con , I probably will not spot it.

We also have vets bills/food etc to pay and there is rarely a cat that comes in that makes 'a profit'. I can't remember the last cat that came in, didn't have anything wrong and was home quickly enough to not cost us much. And thats without the problems of having paid staff that the bigger rescue have.
We ask for £40 unvacced, and as we are getting round to vaccinations if a cat has received both shots we now ask that the owners pay this on top so about £75 (which doesn't get back all the cost of the vaccines which we have to pay normal prices for).

Last year we were down £10k over the year, not too bad but I really don't know where people think we get our money from. this year it's likely to be more - especially if we keep having to rush sick kittens into emergency vets at £200 a go.

When I worked at the CP homing shelter in Birmingham many years ago, there was a notice up in reception that estimated that each cat they homed cost CP about £800 (It might have been £1000). That of course is high but has to be as the cats are quarantine for 3 weeks and you have the shelter costs to pay for plus wages of manager, deputy manager and cattery assistants - something that size cannot be run by volunteers alone.

[Teresa Pawcats]

I'm carrying out research because animal welfare and rescue is my interest, my passion!
Well I hope your passion does more to change the way people treat animals than my work has done; i began 22 years ago and I was going to change the world, you know what nothing changed I just pick up more pieces.

"its coming accross to me that you are trying to find bad or at least belittle rescues".  Absolutely not! What makes you say this please?

Reading bad reviews on certain rescues didnt help and also the way you phrased your question, why say too much rather than ask if rescues are asking enough.

"Maybe you should start looking at the good that is being done". I've never stopped!

Seems to me that your time on Purrs is spent on your own threads, asking people for their opinions; would be nice if you were seen to be actively taking an interest and posting on other threads, particularly ones re your passion rescue

"maybe you should put your energies in to going out and educating people on the benefits of neutering and giving proper pet care".  That's what I do for a living!

Can i ask who is paying you ? as you previously told us you make no money from your research etc."maybe you should volunteer at a rescue": I volunteer for 2 organisations and do around 16 hours per week pro bono for 2 others.

"and do something worthwhile" I think that's a little mean.

just hate it when people take half a sentence from elsewhere to make something sound unfair, this bit is part of a previous sentence

"My doors are open, check me out for yourself" - I'm not checking anyone out. I'm gathering and collating the views of people who have visited rescues.  I am interested in their opinion. Why did they leave without filling an adoption form? Why did they not make a donation? Would they recommend the rescue to another? If not -why not?

It sounds to me that you are checking out, if you arent then all the collating of information is worthless.


Modified to say -Actually I have just noticed which section this is in, surely it pertains to Rescue/Rehoming and should be there.

[Leanne]

No I don't think they charge enough to be honest!

I think we paid £20 for Milo, but we gave a £30 donation on top, he also came with a neuter voucher but we didn't cash it in and paid for it ourselves. I think we only paid £40 for Jess and he came neutered etc, again we gave a donation on top. We also incured £100 in taxi fees as we live no where near the rescue. When we were home checked they actually delivered Jess at the same time to save us the trip, when we got Milo a year later we were allowed to take him there and then because we'd taken Jess on.

I actually work for one of the rescues (canine) that had been reviewed on your site, our prices are determind by lots of things, and vary centre to centre. This is because , "it will be neutered, microchipped, fully up to date with all vaccinations, wormed, treated for fleas, it will have a lead and collar, 4 weeks free insurance with PetPlan, a Pet24 identity disc and a small supply of food". 

 

[miranda luck]

Definitely helps! Many thanks! 

[blackcat]

The charge, or donation required by a rescue for the delivery of a cat is, I suspect, a bit of a test as to the commitment a person has to a) getting an animal and b) having the ability to provide it with on-going care. Pet-keeping is not a cheap exercise, so if you can't afford £60 to get a pet, then how will you afford to pay for veterinary care if it is urgently required?

It does, however, have the effect of turning some people off the idea - and reverting to back yard breeders whose kittens have not had the correct care, and the mother of those kittens may be allowed to breed too frequently.

The cost of keeping an animal at a rescue for the indefinite period between its arrival and departure can vary enormously and rather depends on the condition of the animal on arrival. Some require extensive veterinary care before they can be rehomed. The cost of that care needs to be aggregated across the total number of animals involved. So £60 for a cat that has been in care for a week is expensive, but it is dead cheap if it has been there 12 months recovering from multiple surgery arising from prior mis-treatment.

I do think that rescues need to do a better job of communicating the sorts of expenses that they are covering as many people simply assume they are all receiving funding from some unspecified source. In the case of rescues such as the one Theresa runs, that unspecified source is her hip pocket, plus the funds that can be raised by activities that take away from time that might be better spent with the animals.

So I don't feel it is possible to answer on the basis of fairness. Rather, the question needs to be whether rescues are doing a good job of selling the service they provide. In many instances this would definitely be no. And too often the 'heartstrings' approach is used which tends to lose its effectiveness over time.

So, I guess that really isn't an answer so much as a rant, but I hope it helps.

[miranda luck]

I'm carrying out research because animal welfare and rescue is my interest, my passion!

"its coming accross to me that you are trying to find bad or at least belittle rescues".  Absolutely not! What makes you say this please?

"Maybe you should start looking at the good that is being done". I've never stopped!

"maybe you should put your energies in to going out and educating people on the benefits of neutering and giving proper pet care".  That's what I do for a living!

"maybe you should volunteer at a rescue": I volunteer for 2 organisations and do around 16 hours per week pro bono for 2 others.

"and do something worthwhile" I think that's a little mean.

"My doors are open, check me out for yourself" - I'm not checking anyone out. I'm gathering and collating the views of people who have visited rescues.  I am interested in their opinion. Why did they leave without filling an adoption form? Why did they not make a donation? Would they recommend the rescue to another? If not -why not?

[Teresa Pawcats]

quote author=miranda luck link=topic=33948.msg603738#msg603738 date=1282606156]
Hi! 

What do you think would be a reasonable price? Should it be different for purebred animals? kittens and puppies?
Obviously the rescue/rehoming organisations set a price so that they know the new owner is taking some financial responsibility - and to recoup the cost they have incurred for neutering etc. There is the view that, if a new owner can't afford a one off payment of ie £50.00 for a cat, how will they afford the long term cost of food/vaccinations etc.

What do you think would be a reasonable price? Should it be different for purebred animals? kittens and puppies?

What do you think?
[/quote]

Is this part of your research Miranda or purely a matter if interest?

Speaking bluntly I am a Rescue with nothing to hide,( in fact my doors are always open to inspection as is paperwork) however its coming accross to me that you are trying to find bad or at least belittle rescues.In answer to some of your questions
A reasonable price- there shouldnt have to be one, we dont sell humans what makes animals any different ? Yes I do ask for a donation but as for being able to recoup neutering costs etc. no chance; a good rescuer does her homework and thoroughly checks out each potential home without being stupid enough to think Money equals good home because it doesnt.
You ask should price be different for pure bred animals, kittens and puppies, in my mind an old battered black tom with a tatty ear and limp is as precious and beautiful  as any pedigree or kitten.
Maybe you should start looking at the good that is being done, maybe you should put your energies in to going out and educating people on the benefits of neutering and giving proper pet care, maybe you should volunteer at a rescue and do something worthwhile.
I have done rescue for over 20 years and had well over 5000 cats through my care and still hold my head high with pride at the good reputation of Paws Inn, yes word of mouth plays a big part and asking questions does but nothing like getting off your butt and checking things out yourself if you are in any doubt is the best way of doing things.
I for one do not like your current approach but thats just me so I will say My doors are open, check me out for yourself.

[miranda luck]

I thought the prices were quite reasonable (I'm thinking between £50 and £80) because if you consider neutering costs (which the majority undergo), dentals or other medical intervention (which many need) and parasite treatment and chipping which they generally all have before adoption - it soon adds up.  And to care for a cat at a 'standard' cattery (catering for 50 cats) costs approximately £5.00 per cat per day. 

The thing is - I'm very aware of these costs whereas a person visiting a rescue may not be?

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

What do you think Miranda?

[Shiroi-Neko]

When I adopted Ai Chan the min fee was £75. She was only a 14 weeks old.
I didn't mind paying because I know the money goes to good clause. My local rescue charges £65 for older cat.

[miranda luck]

Hi! 

Obviously the rescue/rehoming organisations set a price so that they know the new owner is taking some financial responsibility - and to recoup the cost they have incurred for neutering etc. There is the view that, if a new owner can't afford a one off payment of ie £50.00 for a cat, how will they afford the long term cost of food/vaccinations etc.

What do you think would be a reasonable price? Should it be different for purebred animals? kittens and puppies?

What do you think?