Author Topic: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM  (Read 35959 times)

Offline Pinkbear (Julie)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #35 on: July 22, 2010, 23:53:25 PM »
Panorama reported them to the insurance company and now the owner faces a huge bill to cover the excess. Nice, Panorama!  :doh:



thought they said Medivet had offered to pay this?



Didn't catch the bit when they said that but that's a good gesture.  ;)

Yes, you're right about us being so used to vets. My own vet calls me his Skiiing holiday.  :rofl: :rofl:

Offline Mark

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #34 on: July 22, 2010, 23:46:31 PM »
I messed up the recording so will have to watch it on iPlayer.
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Offline Den

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #33 on: July 22, 2010, 23:19:42 PM »
It's what happened with Pedigree Dogs Exposed. I wasn't shocked and was really angry over the one sided nonsense. However, most saw it at face value and assumed all Ped dogs were like this. Not the fact it was a very tiny minority and not the norm. So not all vets will be like the ones shown at Medivet. However, the general public will just have the one side as presented by Panorama - they will be shocked. I've read a few comments and people have said they will be boycotting them. It might not look bad if you've got the experience and you might be able to point out all the things done right but all the public will see are the things done wrong.

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Offline Angiew

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #32 on: July 22, 2010, 23:07:07 PM »
Panorama reported them to the insurance company and now the owner faces a huge bill to cover the excess. Nice, Panorama!  :doh:



thought they said Medivet had offered to pay this?

I think us lot are too experienced with vets to be overly shocked but I bet the general public will be - shame it wasn't vets now!

Offline Mark

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #31 on: July 22, 2010, 23:00:25 PM »
I posted about this before. There is a woman that now owns a window-cleaning business. She was telling me that back in the 80s when she was about 18, she worked for a local vet (who is still practicing)  and he was really into tinkering with computers. When animals came in for dentals, he would put them out and get her, an 18 year old unqualified nurse to do the dental while he went off to another room to play with computers.
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Offline Pinkbear (Julie)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #30 on: July 22, 2010, 22:41:41 PM »
Well, well, well...  :sneaky:

I think I knew what kind of programme this was going to be when they came to the catheter incident which was featured on the trailer. The supervisor asked her specifically if she'd been trained to do it and she replied yes, she had. It was quite reasonable of the supervisor to expect her to not have a problem.  :innocent:

The biggest gripe on the programme was overcharging, which I think a lot of us agree almost all vets try to rack up the bill to some extent if they think they can get away with it. One Medivet practice tried to fiddle an insurance claim (presumably to help the owner) as it was a per condition policy. A dog presented with multiple symptoms and needed multiple treatments but there was one root cause which Medivet tried to cover up. By making three separate claims they did not exceed the policy's annual per condition limit.... Panorama reported them to the insurance company and now the owner faces a huge bill to cover the excess. Nice, Panorama!  :doh:

The programme admitted they did not witness any incidents of deliberate cruelty. Apparently she was under cover for 9 months and worked in 15 different practices and I think they showed around 4 incidents of poor practice. There was one male student whose attitude over a distressed Shar Pei stunk but he was confronted and later apologised. But there was also other footage of good, caring staff. In truth, if they can only find 4 cases over nine months in so many practices, I don't think Medivet have a huge problem.

I think they have got to look again at supervising students get and I don't like their business model. Then again I don't like any chains where staff change frequently as you never get a chance to develop a rapport. Overall I don't think they've proved the case about Medivet's being a bad place to take pets.

And can I say... the struck off vet that they featured... I was really impressed with the way he safely handled some very angry and potentially dangerous animals. Turning around the cat to distract it while giving it a jab was genius. 

Offline Angiew

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #29 on: July 22, 2010, 22:29:04 PM »
I think the pricing things annoyed me more than the medical things but then they were nothing I wouldn't expect - and a lot more from my favorite company "vets now"

I was annoyed at the blood letting thing at the rescue though!

Offline nickynoo93

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #28 on: July 22, 2010, 22:24:19 PM »
I have seen a little bit of it, in the ad breaks of Hotel Inspector! I will watch it tomorrow on BBC iPlayer, and keep an open mind until I've watched it all.
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Offline Feline Costumier

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2010, 22:22:05 PM »
I think, as awful as a lot of what they showed was, it has to be considered the size of the business and the length of time she worked for them at various branches to build up the cases shown.

There will be bad everywhere, in every profession and particularly if someone in a position of power filters out their own bad practices to those being managed by them.

I don't think it is anywhere near as bad as I was expecting and to my relief neither my past branch or the vets and nurses who I have dealt with were featured in the programme.

I stand by what I think and would happily use my branch of Medivet again (Finchley).

Offline Kirst

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2010, 22:10:05 PM »
Hmmm I jusy hope that people will not let their pet suffer out of hours rather than take it to Medivet.


I thought the whole thing was very onesided , I am sure there are plenty of good Medivet practioners out there.



Offline Christine (Blip)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #25 on: July 22, 2010, 20:56:35 PM »
I am about to watch it, with a completely open mind.
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Offline Janeyk

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #24 on: July 22, 2010, 20:53:31 PM »
Yes the vast majority of vets will be extemely caring but there will be exceptions and, from what I gather that's what will be shown, not out to say all vets are the same but exposing what's been videoed etc and what I saw was very upsetting.
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Offline Mark

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #23 on: July 22, 2010, 20:41:49 PM »
I think bad vets are the exception. There was a programme last year about a vet in Canterbury that was struck off for bad practice - a really nasty, evil  :censored:  >:(

A woman that worked in a petshop also told me how he abused her sick cat when he came to PTS at home. I won't go int detail but suffic to say, he should be PTS himself for what he did.

I am recording it but will have to watch when OH isn't around. I would like to keep an open mind about it.
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Offline Feline Costumier

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2010, 18:25:05 PM »
Well my vet practice when I lived in London was a small, local branch of Medivet and I found them to be absolutely brilliant. They had two nurses, both of whom made the effort to remember who you were and who your pets are. I saw two different vets in my time with them and they were both really lovely. Dave used to get massive cuddles with the vet cradling him like a baby while discussing him :Luv: Neither of mine are in the least bit bothered by going to the vet and both vet and nurses were full of praise for my two whenever we went in. When Chilli went AWOL they were lovely and really helpful.

So I will watch with interest and a very open mind being that my experience with them was so positive.

Offline Desley (booktigger)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2010, 18:22:18 PM »
According to BBC News just now having a little JRT dog like the one named Lulu can cost an owner £22,000 in their lifetime. Where do they come up with these figures  :Crazy: if BBC news can be so OTT with their 'facts' then hate to see Panorama tonight.

Just what rescues need - overexagerated figures to put people off pet ownership!!
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Offline Den

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2010, 18:19:09 PM »
According to BBC News just now having a little JRT dog like the one named Lulu can cost an owner £22,000 in their lifetime. Where do they come up with these figures  :Crazy: if BBC news can be so OTT with their 'facts' then hate to see Panorama tonight.

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Offline Susanne (urbantigers)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #19 on: July 22, 2010, 16:24:46 PM »
I will watch it with an open mind.  So often these programmes set out with an agenda and then edit footage in a way that seems to prove their point, but doesn't necessarily tell the whole story.

Offline Claire_smc

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #18 on: July 22, 2010, 15:00:37 PM »
Yep, I felt a little uneasy while reading it, not sure why but something about her just didn't sit right with me. I won't be watching it either as I don't have a TV but I will read with interest what people think. Personally I think it will be biased and sensationalist and out of context myself too and should be watched with an open mind.


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Offline Pinkbear (Julie)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #17 on: July 22, 2010, 14:07:15 PM »
There has just been a bit about it on the lunchtime news as well. They showed a highly distressed dog which was obviously in some kind of pain as well. It seems to be a teaching establishment of some kind, or at least a place where they take on trainees, and this 'student vet assistant', AKA the under cover reporter, couldn't put a catheter in the dog's leg to administer a pre-med. Then she made a huge thing of being asked to do it because she was unqualified. She also claimed another member of staff had hit the dog but the clip didn't show that happen, well not as far as I could see. It was probably her bad luck that her first catheterisation happened to be on a large and angry dog but I suspect it was a case of 'in at the deep end' to test her character and see if she really was prepared to stick it out. (Lots of wannabes fancy a bash at working in a vet but when the reality bites they run for the hills. I have always felt I couldn't/can't face it because I see too much of the pain, grief and ignorance of some owners I see during my CP work. ) It looked like the supervision she had wasn't ideal but then again we do not know what else was going in that day... perhaps all the qualified people were in another room fighting to save an animals life?

It is very clear, though, that they are using this footage of this poor dog's state to alarm and sensationalize. I've had to carry out minor things such as cleaning wound sites or applying medication to cats and kittens and when they are distressed the sound of crying and struggling will break your heart. That doesn't mean I'm being careless or heartless while doing it.... but to the outsider it looks and sounds like torture. With a large dog brute force with the restraint sometimes has to be applied I would imagine and sometimes it's going to go badly as was the case in the footage it seems.

They also showed clear evidence of bill hoiking and covering up an in-house whoopsie which resulted in a minor injury to a dog's pad. There was some evidence of other minor botches and perhaps one or two staff being a bit iffy in their practices and approach.... but no worse than our general complaints about Vets Now re pricing and I've seen similar complaints about attitudes and handling on this forum. Every good practice gets lumbered with a dodgy nurse or vet on occasion.... they tend not to last long once the truth is known!

Still open minded here and will watch the full programme with interest. But so far I'm not convinced this practice deserves a Panarama style lynching. Vets Now is a far better target for them!

That link, Claire, written by this 'under cover' girl, read like she's seriously gunning for the Pulitzer! Far too flowery for a basic piece of journalism for my nature... makes me suspect whether she has ponced up her evidence as well as her text.

Offline Rosella moggy

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2010, 13:31:52 PM »
I read that article Claire but like Den would prefer not to watch programme and rely on other Purrs peeps to let me know what they think. 

We use an independent practice but owuld have to rely on Vets Now for out of hours cover.  As it is based at a local PDSA practice, I would hope that it is staffed by caring people  :-:

It is a bit like a horror story.  Truly shocking  :(

Offline Den

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #15 on: July 22, 2010, 13:16:03 PM »
I don't think I'll be watching it but will read what people have to say about it out of interest. I've kind of learned to stay away from BBC exposes after Pedigree Dogs Exposed  :scared:

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Offline Claire_smc

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2010, 12:58:10 PM »
There's an article here explaining some of the stuff that will be on the programme, written by the person who did all the undercover filming

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1296672/Medivet-undercover-investigation-sick-animals-abused-pet-owners-ripped-trainees-carry-life-death-procedures.html


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Offline Kirst

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2010, 16:42:28 PM »
I shall watch it with interest - My local emergency vet is a branch of Medivet , and on the occasions I have been there my cats have been treated like royalty , I couldn't have asked for better service.



Offline Janeyk

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2010, 12:41:33 PM »
Vets are supposed to be caring and the clips I saw last night didn't look pleasant,  there was only one scuffing clip but the animals looked to be treated roughly and cruel I thought a dog was being hit.   I can't watch programmes like that so won't be able to comment after it's been on.
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Offline Pinkbear (Julie)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2010, 12:34:05 PM »
I think that's the crux of this though, Den. The trailer showed a vet nurse scruffing a cat totally out of context with background information. For many folks not used to this kind of thing the sight of that might distress them and cause a knee jerk reaction without understanding why it was scruffed or thinking about the best way to transfer an unknown, strange potentially distressed and dangerous animal from A to B.  :tired: I am afraid in a vet surgery you WILL see distressed and upset animals... you wouldn't go into a hospital and be stunned to see sick people.  :shy:

I do so hope it's an unbiased and fair programme and can substantiate it's points.... what are the chances of me getting my wish?  :innocent:


Offline Den

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2010, 12:22:36 PM »
Without wanting this to turn this thread into a discussion on scruffing. I know fully well my vets will scruff Memphy and I've given them my permission to do whatever they have to with him. He is very, very dangerous in a vets surgery. He's a total Jekyll and Hyde. However, Mig is as cool as a cucumber. My vet said they usually don't like dealing with rabbits as they are a bit of a nightmare for them (my vets are large animal), but they find Mig a pleasure because he is so good, so relaxed and so well behaved. He doesn't flinch instead he just has a good wander around being nosey and leaving mountains of hair over everything. Even when he was having his stitches out he just led there and the nurse said she's never had a rabbit that easy. Yet when I took him and had the 'now banned vet' she was soooooooooooooooooooo rough with him. I told her he doesn't need scruffing and will just sit there but she did it her own way. Miggy loves the vets and is certainly not stressed. I don't mind scruffing if it needs to be done, such as with Memphy, but not when it doesn't need to be done, such as Mig. None of the other vets/nurses would ever consider grabbing Mig by the neck .. however, they are getting to the stage of doing a coin toss over who is the lucky soul who gets to deal with Memphis   :scared:

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Offline Pinkbear (Julie)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2010, 12:02:20 PM »
I've seen some trailers (maybe not all versions?) on the telly and to be honest I'll wait to see the whole programme before passing comment. The trailer bits I saw didn't feature anything I haven't already seen or expected to see in a busy vert surgery... A vet surgery is not a natural place to be and a pet's behaviour while there can often be atypical of the way that pet normally behaves. First off, they are not there for fun and are usually in some form of pain when they arrive. Many of the cats I've dealt with are certainly very angry at times of stress or when in pain. And none of my own cats would allow a stranger to scoop them up in a strange place without a strong complaint even when they are fit and well. I know that scruffing can evoke a lot of discussion but it is a relatively safe way of handling angry or stressed animals. It might be upsetting to watch but there's usually a good reason why vets do it... I've never met a vet or vet nurse that enjoyed making an animal upset.

Hopefully this will not just be a sensationalist piece designed to alarm people with no conclusive evidence. If I see blatant mistreatment or abuse in the full programme then that's another matter... but I'd also like to see some unbiased professional comments featured in the programme and an explanation of the correct and safes ways to handle distressed and dangerous animals.  ;)

Offline Janeyk

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2010, 11:54:17 AM »
I saw the ad for this last night after Panorama and the few clips they showed turned my stomach.  It made me so angry to see, I won't be able to watch it but thankfully what's been going has been discovered and reported.
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Offline Yvonne

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2010, 11:14:07 AM »
I had never heard of Medivets previously so did a search and found this:

http://www.medivet.co.uk/news_view.asp?id=112
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Offline puggy1975 Zoe

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2010, 20:23:28 PM »
Makes great sence. The more i think about it i really should watch to find out what these poor animals get put through.

And spread the word. Exposure is the best thing for people treating animals bad when they meant to be helping.
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Offline Michelle (furbabystar)

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2010, 20:17:17 PM »
but least it is exposing them.

I will try and watch it for exactly that reason....
I almost feel I owe it to the animals involved (does that make sense ?)

Offline puggy1975 Zoe

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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2010, 20:14:37 PM »
Seen it advertised in paper. Not sure if i can watch but least it is exposing them. Was not sure if would have been vets now but from what i read its not
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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2010, 19:27:40 PM »
i wish i could watch this but i know that i would cry, the poor things. it makes me so angry that these horrible things go on and you leave your pets there with the best intentions
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Re: It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2010, 19:20:38 PM »
This is about Medivets. I'm not sure I'll watch it but it might be worth it for those who are clients to form their own opinions on this.

Offline Den

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It shouldn't happen at a vets - Panorama. Thursday, BBC1, 9PM
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2010, 18:36:29 PM »
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00t66pb

I saw the advert for this a little earlier and it's shocking. I'm not sure if I will be able to watch it, but thought I'd mention it here for others.

One of the vets in my practice scruffed Mig the bun right in front of me after I told her not to. Needless to say she has been banned from having anything to do with my animals - if I can't trust her in front of me, I certainly can't any other time.

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