Ollie Bonga thread....he's getting his teeth out next week....

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Taken from that site...

Surgical tooth extraction is often necessary to alleviate the pain FLPS cats experience. The rationale for this treatment is that the teeth harbor the plaque bacteria. By removing the teeth we are removing the plaque bacteria. However, even this treatment only addresses the symptoms -- not the cause. We may suggest extracting the cheek teeth (premolars and molars) first, to see how effective this is in controlling the inflammation. A cat's appearance changes very little with this procedure, because the front teeth (canines and incisors) remain in place. Eventually all teeth may need extraction. As veterinary dentists, we do not like suggesting this option, but sometimes the welfare of the patient necessitates it. Again, it is very important that all tooth substance is removed, since any fragments left behind can be a cause for treatment failure. Dental X-rays will confirm that this has been accomplished. Typically, once a cat has recovered from the surgery, he is able to eat remarkably well.

Which sounds very much like Ollie's case.

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

http://www.veterinarydental.com/veterinarians/flps.php

That looks Like Ollie's mouth,   although it's not at the front, thats why the vet is unsure it will do anything having is teeth out. Maybe he just doesn't want to get my hopes up  

Oh yes Des, Ollie never ate a biscuit untill he had his back teeth out 

[Desley (booktigger)]

There is a good chance he will though CC - Sam did still get ulcers, but his was likely calici related. They didn't bother him though, he ate better than when he had all his teeth.

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

he will be pain free and a lot healthier

Thats it, the vet doesn't know if removing them will make a difference, but it's something that has to be tried 

It's plasmacytic stomatitis  Ollie has, is this what Clapton and Schui had?

[Desley (booktigger)]

Glad to hear this.

[Janeyk]

  that's good news! I do hope that the dental helps Ollie as much as it did my Schui 

[Mark]

Good news. I am sure once his teeth are out, he will be pain free and a lot healthier 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Ollie is doing well, the growth was caused by the infection, so nothing to worry about  He's getting booked in for his op next week 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

that will be the end of it -

It possibly will be Mark, if the growth has not reacted to the steriods the vet is unsure about doing the op  so I just have to hope and pray that its not what the vet thinks it is 

[Mark]

Hopefully that will be the end of it - Clapton was a different cat after he had his last ones out 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Ollie's going back to the vets tomorrow to see when/ if we can book him in for the dental. The vet is now concerned as he's found a growth under his tounge 

Hopefully he can get the rest of his teeth out and the lump is not what it's worried to be 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Me too 

The vet said he was speaking to another vet and they said it's an option but they dont know if it would be any use, but it's worth a try  anything has to be worth a try 

The meds arnt working for him so something else has to be done, he cant keep going to the vets every 2 weeks for a steriod jab- sooner or later its going to take effect somewhere else in his body 

So the plan is to get rid of the infection then maybe put him back on the steriod tablets (not the ovarid) for a week or so and then if they have no effect his teeth will be coming out. Its the infection thats making the tablets not work and I dont know why he's had the infection for so long this time, its been around 4 months on and off 

Its also not as simple as just taking his teeth out and thats going to work, as we found last year the bad skin and swelling is right down his throat not just in his mouth 

[Desley (booktigger)]

Fingers crossed for the dental

[Janeyk]

Poor Ollie 
hope that the dental sorts things out for him xx 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Had Ollie back to the vets today, he's got the infection again  on the plus side he may be having the rest of his teeth out in 2 weeks 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Thats it, when Ollie's mouth is fine he looks like a really gorgeous cat, his fur is nice and smooth and shiney. When he's not so well he does look in a sorry state 

[Mark]

The other great thing is I don't have to wash my hands when Clapton gives me a wash thesedays  - which is any time I go near him. Clapton loves washing my hands and face  He also manages to keep himself clean. The only big problem he has is his claws. I bought some clippers with a guard but he is terrified so it looks like another home visit to get them done 

[Desley (booktigger)]

I have had numerous cats without teeth, and all have been able to eat everything, including raw meat (although i had to cut it into small chunks for Ginger). My neighbour was surprised at Sam eating biscuits cos he has no teeth, but he doesnt' let anything stop him, and prefers his wet with a bit of dry on it. Interestingly, I have two cats here with gum issues, one with teeth, one with no teeth, and the only one I have to mash food up for is the one with teeth. Unfortunately, it hasn't stopped Sam's red gums, but you can only tell when you open his mouth, you wouldnt know otherwise.

[Mark]

Clapton eats biscuits when he is in the mood  - he manages cooked chicken, steak etc as well although I do cut it up quite small as I don't want to risk him choking. He likes it if I shred meat rather than cut it.

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Also interestingly cats teeth are not designed for chewing, but ripping and swallowing, certainly all the toothless cats i know eat all kinds of food without a hitch, including raw!

Well Ollie eats biscuits now since having his other teeth out, whereas he wouldn't touch them before when he had teeth to eat them- just goes to show they dont really need their teeth to eat 

[Millys Mum]

Hope his jab kicks in soon cc 

We tried him on ovarid and loads of different options over the years but we didn't take his teeth out as our vet said (and it made sense) why take out the teeth when its the gums thats the problem.  By taking out the teeth you are making it even harder for them to eat as they then have no teeth to chew with and are left to use only the red inflamed gums to eat with.  But again - every case is different but taking the teeth out won't necessarily resolve the issue.

The easy way of explaining it is that the gums are basically allergic to the teeth and tartar.
I read a very interesting paper which concluded although extractions wont cure every case there was a very good success rate, from memory around 80%. Which for me is good odds 
Also interestingly cats teeth are not designed for chewing, but ripping and swallowing, certainly all the toothless cats i know eat all kinds of food without a hitch, including raw!

[Janeyk]

Best of luck with the jab and good that the vet is willing to remove all teeth if need be - anything is worth a try 

[madkittyrescue]

paws crossed

[Dawn F]

good its got to be worth a try and I know you'll do anything to keep him well

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

He's been given a steriod jab and we have to go back in 2 weeks to see how its going. Vet said taking the rest of his teeth out will be an option before pts is thought about 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Thanks Sarah 

Its just getting to the point now that the meds are failing and there will soon be nothing else to do  Ollie is only 5 he deserves a chance 

After having his other teeth out that did help him a lot, he now even eats biscuits which he never did before. Its just when he gets an infection he goes down hill really quick and its sad to see him that way 

Ollie needs constant steriods to keep this at bay, if he doesn't have them his throat will close over and he wouldn't be able to breath or even eat. The last time he was fit as a fiddle for 10 months untill he got the infection again 

Its looks like the infection has gone as the green drool is not round his mouth now 

[madkittyrescue]

have just caughtup with this thread and thought I'd put in my tuppance worth as we have Jo Jo here an elderly puss with the same problem.

We tried him on ovarid and loads of different options over the years but we didn't take his teeth out as our vet said (and it made sense) why take out the teeth when its the gums thats the problem.  By taking out the teeth you are making it even harder for them to eat as they then have no teeth to chew with and are left to use only the red inflamed gums to eat with.  But again - every case is different but taking the teeth out won't necessarily resolve the issue.

For the last 12 months we have stopped all medications for Jo Jo - if he goes through a bad spell we inject him with Convenia which settles it down again great and he's back to normal within a day or two.  His mouth is a mess but he is happy, eats well - even eats biscuits but I think as well he had to reach a point where he could cope with his mouth the way it was.  He's had to have surgery a couple of times to remove flaps that have formed on his gums - but he still has his teeth and I have been known to give him placque off stuff and mouth washes which also help.

I don't say this to confuse you but wanted to give you another viewpoint from someone who has a cat with the same problem   good luck with the vets hope all goes well.

If you want to ask me anything specific re Jo Jo you're welcome to drop me a PM 

[Janeyk]

Hope all goes well today 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

 

I wont be changing vets, I have used them for 7 years and they are the best around here, thats my view anyway  If it hadn't of been for them Ollie would of not been here by now because of the pdsa, but my vets agreed with me and helped Ollie as they thought he still had a good life to live, they have helped me enormously with Ollie and if it wern't for them he wouldn't be here today 

I think the vet will agree, he knows my feelings over this so I think they would be willing to try to actually see if it does work 

[Desley (booktigger)]

Good luck today

[Mark]

I your vet says no, maybe time to change vets. I hate knowing they are in pain 

Clapton used to sit at the dish wanted to eat but ended up with a food aversion as he associated food with pain in the end. it used to break my heart when he wiped his mouth with his paw 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

I know it's like their own body attacking them and killing them 

[Janeyk]

Yes that's what Ollie has Janey.

Thought it sounded similar, it must be horrible for them 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

Yes that's what Ollie has Janey.

[Janeyk]

It doesn't work for all cats I believe but certainly worked for our Schui, he was on steroids, abs, mouth gels and I had to scrape plaque off his teeth every day it just built up which wasn't pleasant but had to be done we tried everything.   He'd had some teeth removed before we adopted him but eventually the vet suggested taking them all out and it was a blessing.  I do hope Ollie can be helped with Schui it was an autoimmune problem and it sounds similar with Ollie 

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

I also believe that Dawn 

If it is an intolerance to plaque then having his teeth out should stop that.

Vets tomorrow 

[Dawn F]

my vet is a bit fan of removing all the teeth, she says the gums seal and stop the infection getting in - I suppose as with everything they've all got their own opinion

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

  peeps 

Yes I am going to push for the other teeth to be removed, the vet has only said it's an option but one he thinks wouldn't work- he didn't say they wouldn't do it so Im guessing they will, I hope so 

Ollie will be 6 this year and the poor little begger has suffered with this most of his life, he's been on meds since being 6 months old it was noticed when he was neutered. Its strange as Ollie is uncle to one of my mums cats and also one of my aunts and they both had mild Gingivitis 

Its also a really stressing condition to manage and try to stay on top of- Ollie is fine but when he gets an infection then he goes down hill really quick  It also    me off as Ollie is a well cat other than this and he shows he wants to be alive and he can live a happy life when he's not really ill 

The vet wants to help Ollie as much as I do and he is constantly apologising that he cannot cure him  Im hoping he agrees to having the rest removed 

[Desley (booktigger)]

Good luck with tomorrows visit, I really would push for his remaining teeth to be removed.

[Mark]

Something that is important with the extractions is complete removal including the root

I read that too and was going to edit my post. I have read this in humans as well. I read about cases where people had arthritis which went after root fragments were removed.

By the sounds of it, chlorhexidine mouth wash, in the short term might help. I know it is good at killing mouth bugs - the only thing I am against is the stuff they sell to add to drinking water as I don't think it is good to be swallowed as it will kill the good as well as the bad bacteria in the gut.