Topic: Makosi meant to be going in to be spayed tommorow :( (Read 34727 times)

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #42 on:** March 05, 2007, 14:19:53 PM »

Furbaby : awwwwwwww that sounds great that all the babies stayed with mum
how many cats do u have alltogether ? have u got the dad cat ?or was he a randy tom around ur neighbour hood ?

Michelle (furbabystar) · « **Reply #41 on:** March 05, 2007, 14:10:56 PM »

CC - No Still dont agree with abortion even in early stages .

Ela - Do CP abort even in later stages of pregnancy ? What is the cut off ?

Forever - You do what you think is right. If you can afford to keep the kittens then go for it! My Issey had 4 kittens and i kept all 4. Issey has an amazing bond with them and they deff know that she is Mum and she knows they are her babies.

Beccles · « **Reply #40 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:45:35 PM »

Quote from: forever_missing_my_boys on March 05, 2007, 13:30:22 PM

oh does it make any difference if the mother cat is small does it mean they have less kittens then a bigger cat or dont it go by that ?

is it true all kittens are born with fleas and worms??????????????

even if the mother is being treated every month with stronghold ?

No... sometimes a very small, thin cat can have 8 or 9 kittens or a lovely big strong one will just have one or two. That's why there's such a risk involved - moreso if the kittens dad is a big lad.

Fleas and worms have to come from somewhere... so if mum hasn't got them, kittens won't either.

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #39 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:44:45 PM »

We could argue all day about this because we all have different viewpoints (about human abortion too). I do tend to agree with the argument that although these lives might be saved if it means another cat loses it's life as a consequence then lives aren't really being saved. But it is an emotive issue and I respect you, forever, for having made a decision and wanting to stick by it. If you feel it wouldn't be right to go ahead with a spay/abort then go with your instincts.

The only advice I can give you (never having had kittens) is to be prepared for every eventuality. Yes many cats give birth without complications every day but many end up having emergency cesarians too. Make sure you are prepared for that possiblity and can afford it. I also think it would be worth making enquiries about rehoming the kittens in case your current plans dont work out. If it's a large litter you may end up with more than 1 or 2 to keep. Grown up kittens dont always get on with their mum either or they may not get on with your current cats so your plan to keep most of them may not work out. Best to be prepared with alternatives.

CurlyCatz · « **Reply #38 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:42:32 PM »

i do find some things here worrying

no the kittens will not be born with fleas but could get them within minutes of being born if the mother had, if shes under treatent then that should be ok. the kittens at a certain age should be treated with appropriate wormer.

is strong hold safe to use on a pregnant and or lactating queen ??? if not then thats atleast 2 -3 months of no treatment !!

size of cat doesnt always follow as regards to size or amount of kittens.

the cost of feeding your cats would be least of your worries compared to vets bills/insurance etc etc

are you jsut presuming your family would take one each or has serious thought and consideration gone into it and planning put into action about introducing kittens if they already have cats etc...sorry not havin a go just all things that need to be thought about. also if you find good homes thats great but what if the cat were to have say 6 kittens, your family are going to take two..could you really keep 4 ??

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #37 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:40:44 PM »

i have 7 cats
and one german shepherd dog
i cant have children myself so they are my babies they get treated like id treat my own son or daughter if i had one .

ccmacey · « **Reply #36 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:37:38 PM »

Forever, I wasnt trying to scare you, I just thought that would be the best option as you said you couldnt give them away. Im pregnant so if I thought termination was ok, I wouldnt be pregnant cos it wasnt planned. But if you got homes for them with family thats the best option.

How many cats u got?

The kittens can get fleas if the mother passes them on but I dont think they are born with them.

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #35 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:30:22 PM »

oh does it make any difference if the mother cat is small does it mean they have less kittens then a bigger cat or dont it go by that ?

is it true all kittens are born with fleas and worms??????????????

even if the mother is being treated every month with stronghold ?

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #34 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:25:06 PM »

im from portsmouth in hampshire
my mum and sister would want to have one and ill b able to visit them regually as im always at my mums and sisters house lol ( they both have a cat already and look after them very well)
the others will stay with us ( unless an excellent home could b found ) which i dont know any one that i could trust well enough apart from my familey , i already buy 48 tins of cat meat a week for my lot so one or two more mouths to feed wont make a difference lol
as long as the kittens are happy healthy and protected from any diseases etc and protected from any dangers then ill be happy .

CurlyCatz · « **Reply #33 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:17:27 PM »

i think fair dues to you forever, you have weighed up the pros and cons obviously and hopefully aware of the hefty bills should any problems arise (thankfully in cats these are less often but can non the less happen)

Should worst come to worst have you thought about how you will rehome these kittens (sorry i dont know where you are from)

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #32 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:11:53 PM »

TO CC im sorry but u can say the same about women and child birth theres a chance a woman could die during childbirth or just after ( i know this as i nearly lost my mum 12 years ago when she had my sisiter )
I Dont think u should be scare mongering and trying to scare me to death by saying i could lose my cat through her having kittens !

Every day of the week cats have kittens with little or no help from a vet or even the owner and the mother cat and kittens are all fine ! ive heard of many cats having there kittens during the night and the next morning the owners find them and all is well , im sorry but at the end of the day all i can do is make sure makosi gets the best medical attention and make sure that myself and my partner are there for her if and when the time comes and obviously if there was the slightest problem then i would phone the vet straight away , im praying she isnt pregnant ! but if she is then im doing what i think is right and terminating little precious lives isnt right imo .

To everyone else who has offered help and advice then im most greatful thank u .

CurlyCatz · « **Reply #31 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:10:14 PM »

i think the mother will have a life either way but my concern is the long term care of the kittens..ie for next 14 ish years ?? what if the litter was like floras last one..that was 9 kittens wasnt it !

ccmacey · « **Reply #30 on:** March 05, 2007, 13:07:37 PM »

But what if in the early stages Michelle? And she said she couldnt get homes cos she couldnt give them away.

I also believe a life is a life but the mother deserves a life too.

Michelle (furbabystar) · « **Reply #29 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:56:24 PM »

Only just seen this thread.

Ok here goes -
I 100% agree with the view of "a life is a life"

I would NOT abort these babies (if she is pregnant)

ccmacey · « **Reply #28 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:23:24 PM »

Have you made a desicion yet?

Ellie · « **Reply #27 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:15:22 PM »

This subject always cause emotions on both sides of the argument. Personally I don't know what I would do and luckily have never been in the situation.

However now that you have made your decision Forever I wish you the best of luck and I'm sure that the peeps on here will give you lots of support and advice

CurlyCatz · « **Reply #26 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:11:40 PM »

yes cc, was qualified vn and head nurse but havent worked full time since having connor, did locums in the initial year or two but since then havent worked at all, altho i do still communicate with a few vets and of course nurses.

CurlyCatz · « **Reply #25 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:10:32 PM »

oh and i didnt mean everyone on benefits were like that but some i was on about were a certain type on the worst estates, that had no idea not to "curse and swear" in front of you, werent very clean etc and well...you know the type.

I'd say most of the .. god i never know how to describe social classes without sounding awful..ok most of the "normal" type of everyday folk..which i class myself as, if they were told it was late stages of pregnancy often regardless of advice they would have made the decision to take puss home and return for spaying after the kittens.

ccmacey · « **Reply #24 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:09:57 PM »

Are you a vet nurse Lynn?

CurlyCatz · « **Reply #23 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:06:22 PM »

my opinion and experience...cats who are suspected to be in early stages of pregnancy i'd go ahead with the spay..cats who are in mid to late stages of pregnancy i'd leave well along.

I have personally witnessed and aissisted in termination in all and every stage of pregnancy some / often were known about others a complete suprise. There have been a few but thankfully the minority where the late stages i would be boiling with anger and fizzing about. of course the decision to perform the op wasnt mine to make and i did see the "superiors" reasoning for doing so(often the case the owners were on benefits and were to be honest the type you may question or would definately question them being allowed to own 1 cat never mind entrusted to do all nec treatments and rehome a litter of kittens)
..altho at the cost of getting myself in trouble via shouting at my boss lol. i did insist on injecting the foetuses with dolethal the minute the uterus was remvoed from mum and not wait the minute or so it would take for them to die naturally, of course these kittens were still in situ in uterine horns so you couldnt actaully see them...there would be no point in removing them as that would only serve to distress me / other workers more.

I have disected some uterine horns and in the early stages it really is a mass of cells and no distinguishable kitten and on the balancing act of vast amount of unwatned / uncared for cats then i didnt feel bad then.

ccmacey · « **Reply #22 on:** March 05, 2007, 12:02:11 PM »

And why would you want to put your cat through that? There is also a risk you could loose her so better to be kind now and think of her future. Think of what you have got now not what you could have.

Ela · « **Reply #21 on:** March 05, 2007, 11:57:11 AM »

Quote

have you got enough set aside for an emergency caesarian if she needs

It is absolutely alarming how many calls we receive for help with this and it is always at night when there is an put if hours charge. Of course we are here for cats that do not have an owner and the donations are made for Cats Protection cats, so in these circumstances we only pay if the cat is signed over to us. The last time this happened the cat was in such a bad state the bill was in excess of £400.

Beccles · « **Reply #20 on:** March 05, 2007, 11:47:09 AM »

Every kitten born and homed means that some other cat, already born and living, somewhere, will not have a home. Most of them will end up being euthanised. Not only is kittening dangerous, stressful and painful for the mum cat (and for your wallet if there's any problem - have you got enough set aside for an emergency caesarian if she needs it?) but it is fundamentally bringing more cats into a world where there are already far, far more living than there are safe, warm homes for them.

When it comes down to it, I prioritise the welfare of the souls already living and needing than of those little ones not even born yet. Which is very sad, and very hard, and a lot of people that I like and respect very much have different views.

ccmacey · « **Reply #19 on:** March 05, 2007, 11:24:04 AM »

Do you have the time and money for lifelong care of all the kittens? She could have a few, and what if 1 had a serious health problem that needed expensive vet treatment?

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #18 on:** March 05, 2007, 11:18:54 AM »

she is 19mths old thou ,she is an adult cat .

ccmacey · « **Reply #17 on:** March 05, 2007, 11:13:49 AM »

It maybe getting rid of the kittens but think of the cat having to go through motherhood at a young age, i think it takes the kitten out of them.

Ela · « **Reply #16 on:** March 05, 2007, 11:07:09 AM »

Quote

Ela
So in truth C.P. cannot boast a no kill policy

Sorry I am not getting into this to much as we all have very different views and I don't like my view at all but do what is in a cats intererest. I once took a kitten to the vets that was no more than 6 months old and quite small yet she was pregnant. There was no way she could have gone on to have the kittens with safety. We get some cat in who are pregnant and yet have kittens no more than 8 weeks old and are trying to kill them, again it is just not fair in my view.
The views of our branch are not necessarily the views of CP as a whole, I have no idea about other branches.

Quote

I have always found the space,the money

Unfortunately some days we are being asked to bring in between 20 and 30 cats and kittens and with the best will in the world it is impossible. Only a few mins ago I have been asked to bring in 2 x 10 year olds and many of the cats we have in care are oldies or have problems and it is not so easy to home so pens are blocked up for longer.

We all do what we feel is in a cat best interest and perhaps based on experiences we have had.

If we were in an ideal situation, had a copious amount of fosterers and pens and more homes than cats and kittens then things may be different, although a cats interest must come first. Also our vets bills are usually over £3000 a month which is an enormous amount for us to raise as there are so few of us. Again if we had dozens of kittens constantly they older cats would not get a look in and I doubt if we would be able to raise the funds to cope. I would hate for the cats that have already been used and abused to be let down by us because we did not have the funds.

Teresa Pawcats · « **Reply #15 on:** March 05, 2007, 10:37:42 AM »

Ela
So in truth C.P. cannot boast a no kill policy
I have been in rescue for many years and yes I have seen just about every horror sight out,somehow as a one man band I have always found the space,the money and time and more importantly the love,care and committment until each is found an excellent home(and believe me I am very particular).
I spay all of my rescues and encourage people to neuter but at the end of the day an unborn kitten is a life even though you cant see him/her.

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #14 on:** March 05, 2007, 10:25:13 AM »

I went in the vets this morning and cancelled the spay for today and will see what happens next ,
i spoke to a lady at the portsmouth cpl and she said as makosi is 19mths old (not a kitten herself ) and has never had a littler before then theres no reason for her to have the kittens terminated if she was indeed pregnant , she said it would be a different story if she was ( a ) very young . or ( b ) a cat who has had many litters .

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Ela · « **Reply #13 on:** March 05, 2007, 09:46:14 AM »

The following is the advice we five our fosterers:-

It is the policy of the group to terminate any pregnant cats when the vet thinks it is safe to do so? This decision has not been an easy one but in the cats interest. Carrick vets carry out this procedure in a most professional manner and ensure the kittens do not suffer as a result of the termination and we don’t like it however, our reasons are purely in the interest of the cats and the cat population in general. We can usually find homes relatively easy for our kittens however, that could well be at the expense at the life of another somewhere else who could meet an cruel extinction due to the fact that there are too many kittens and the owner cannot find a home for it or more usually them. The horror stories we hear almost daily are beyond belief and heartbreaking. Also the mother cat by having the termination is less at risk from certain ailments and mammary problems including mammary cancer if she does not have the kittens. We are doing the cat and the cat population no favours by letting the pregnancy continue we need to put the cat first in spit of our own feelings and thoughts. Also the pen that is blocked up by the kittens could be used to save another’s cats life, there are so many cats with no one to care for them and if we cannot take them in they suffer.

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #12 on:** March 05, 2007, 09:40:41 AM »

Awwww Thank u Teresa

Teresa Pawcats · « **Reply #11 on:** March 05, 2007, 08:39:02 AM »

Forever
I truly hope that she isnt pregnant.
Like others I agree that there are too many unwanted kittens in the world, HOWEVER to me a life is a life from the moment of conception and I would never abort. I will pray for God to guide you and am sure that if there are kittens lots of us will be able to advise you.
Thinking of you
Teresa x

Desley (booktigger) · « **Reply #10 on:** March 05, 2007, 08:18:24 AM »

I personally would go for spaying regardless, she is obviously young herself, and young mums can have a lot of probs - how would you manage if she struggled at being a mum and you had to hand rear all the kittens? Then there are the risks to herself, there was a breeder on my other forum who had to have a c-section on her pedigree, the mum died and she had to hand rear the full litter of kittens, we lost 2 mum cats last year. And then there is the expense of extra food and litter - when I last had a litter of kittens with mum, it was at least £20 a week just for food and litter, and then worm and flea treatments on top of that. Plus the fact there are soo many cats needing homes already, and can you really keep every single kitten, bearing in mind you dont know how many she could have?

Ela · « **Reply #9 on:** March 05, 2007, 08:14:36 AM »

Quote

only god can choose to take away a life !

Unfortunately it is people who choose to take away a life and PTS hundreds of thousands of cats and kittens a year quite simply because there are far too many and homes cannot be found.

Ela · « **Reply #8 on:** March 05, 2007, 08:10:50 AM »

Quote

A cat on here recently had 9 kittens! Could you keep 9?

Not too long ago we knew of one household who had 2 females i gave birth to 12 kittens and the other 13 all at the same time.

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #7 on:** March 04, 2007, 23:49:29 PM »

he was about 5 n a half months old when i found him the vet guessed his age by looking at his teeth and that .

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #6 on:** March 04, 2007, 23:21:14 PM »

If she was around an unneutered tom then it's very likely they got jiggy

How old was Max at the time?

forever_missing_my_boys(Lisa) · « **Reply #5 on:** March 04, 2007, 23:13:13 PM »

Im Hoping shes not pregnant but if she is then yeah it will be very hard work all round , ill be so nervous when its time for her to have them , but as long as they are all healthy and happy i dont mind , i know cats dont think like people and wouldnt have any feelings about a termination but i would and it would kill me inside ! , only god can choose to take away a life !
ill just have to see what happens hopefully shes just late coming on season or something

Susanne (urbantigers) · « **Reply #4 on:** March 04, 2007, 22:40:17 PM »

It's very likely that she's pregnant. It's totally your call about whether or not you go for a spay/abort. Personally I would go for it as cas don't have the same emotions as humans so it's not like a human having an abortion, but I can understand why you would feel uncomfortable doing that and you have to do what you feel is right.

If you decide to let her go ahead with her pregnancy I'm sure you'll get lots of advice and tips from people on here who have had pregnant cats. Just try to be realistic about what you will do with the kittens. You say you would want to keep them but could you keep 6 kittens? A cat on here recently had 9 kittens! Could you keep 9?

Team Svartalfheims · « **Reply #3 on:** March 04, 2007, 22:24:19 PM »

Accidents do happen but personally I'd say get her spayed anyway. Kittens are a lot of work and very expensive.

Can you afford to vaccinate 7 or so kittens at £70ish each and to deworm them every few weeks as kittens and Frontline them and spay/neuter them at 5 months at the latest plus all the extra food Makosi will eat whilst pregnant and lactating and all the food the kitens will eat? Will you be able to take a week off of work around her due date so you are on hand for the babies being born. And of course that is assuming everything goes well. Can you afford an emergency c section if she needs one or treatment for mastitis? Out of hours vets fees are also very expensive so if she has a problem giving birth in the middle of the night then you could have a huge bill. Any illness or cost that is related to pregnancy or birth will not be covered by insurance.

Author Topic: Makosi meant to be going in to be spayed tommorow :( (Read 34727 times)

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