Outside access Poll

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

I think its a case of...if we lived in a perfect world where we knew our cats were not going to come to any harm outdoors, then I think most of us would give them free reign. But you cant trust anyone these days and I understand why some people keep indoors, give free reign and have a cat proofed garden.

With 6 cats I am using all of these options atm, but really with the world we live in I would like them to stay in my cat proofed garden.  That would be my choice, not their's.

[JackSpratt]

It doesn't follow of course that I think others with indoor only puds are mistreating them   

Exactly    I think the tone of some previous posts suggested that, whether intentionally or not...

That may have been my fault - wording is not always my strong point. I have regular misunderstandings with my partner because of how I've phrased what I was trying to say. (Not arguments, just him saying "Is that actually what you meant?" and then telling me how it came across! ) I know Lucas and Riley want for nothing, as I'm sure is the case with a lot of other indoor only cats. (Including Memphy - sorry, Den! Just read your post on the other thread.)

[MrsR]

If we kept Poppy in she'd go insane.       When we kept her in after she did a hudini for a while she was going stir crazy.

[Ela]

Well looks like I cant just get away with eating popcorn this time! 

Well in my opinion you could have continued to eat popcorn,  it was quite clear the meaning of it. 

[Bonkers Mad!!!]

i agree, it absolutely does depend on the cat.  i let mine out around 9.30 in the morning (after the school run is over).    of the 3 that do roam, 1, Socks would be simply impossible to keep in.  i dont have a cat flap, i have a small window in the kitchen that is the "cat window".  i have had to put a lock on it because Socks has sussed out how to open it. every morning the latch has been flipped and if it wasnt for the extra lock she would be gone before daybreak.  when i open the window they all rush out at once but only Socks and Pubes have a destination in mind (the "over the back" avary).  the rest go for a wee and then either come back in or snooze in the garden.  i've been blessed with mostly lazy cats and when it's in time there are usually at least 7 (and the 2 kittens) in.  i only ever have problems with Pubes and Socks.  Pubes will come and then run, wait until you are close and then run again.  he thnks it's fun, i don't!  Socks on the other hand just wants to be out all the time.  a lotof the time she has to be tricked into coming in (ham or cheese).  i honestly think that apart from those 2 the rest would be content to stay in all the time.  Sam is the only one i worry about.  i live on a quiet road but the road that runs parallel has speed humps so my road is sometimesused as a cut through.  i live opposite a field and Sam quite likes to sit over there watching the wood pigeons.  i spend all day checking out of the window to make sure he's not over there.  i think Merlin will be the same which is why i'm holding off from letting him out.

[Leanne]

Every cat and situation is different. Jess came to us as indoor only he'd never been out, over time with the harness he learnt that the garden could be a fun place. The same happened with Milo except he was a stray.

Even now in the garden Milo is the jumpy cat at noises. Jess just sits in the middle of the grass. We too have seen no real behaviour changes from taking them outside.

What is funny though is that as soon as the clocks change they will meow to go out for "walkies" but if its too cold they go out turn round and come in  they are fair weather cats.

[Liz]

Free roaming is an unusual phrase ours that can are free roaming during our stipulated hours with access to the house from the utility room and dining room - most are in by the time I get home at 17.45pm and the stragglers are in by teatime for us at 7pm.

Ours free roam in the garden, paddocks and woods but not up the hill towards our neighbours and the sheep currently in the fields behind us

Our neighbours 3 kitten terrorists aged 9 months have access 24/7 to the outside and can be found waiting in the shrubbery for our lot to come out and play

Also no way to cat proof 5 acres of boundary fencing and we also have to consider with fencing the dogs from up the hill coming to play with ours - sometimes they have a better social life than we do!


We have always lived in rural "safe" places but have lost 2 to RTA's other friends have lived on busy roads and lost none so sometimes its the luck of the drawer

On an interesting note our vets have yet to guess correctly who is indoor only from all 43 Clan Cats so I think it depends on the cat a lot of the time

As I have all categories I can see from all folks point of view but feel everyone should be entitled to an opinion even if its not what folks want to hear

Also cats do adapt to living inside from our experience wether it is domestic, pedigree or feral - we have them all and they do adapt they don't rip their hair out, go off food or have issues with life in general sometimes its just the humans but Ace and Blue are both mixing with all the others and love their special extra treats sadly some do contain wormer's but they have yet to discover that!

[Desley (booktigger)]

Mine are allowed to free roam, although my own two rarely leave my bedroom, much less the house!! All 4 current fosters are allowed to go out, but we have a system - Kiz and Sam are allowed to go out before I go to work, Sam occasionally has to be let in by the neighbour though. Door is opened again when I get home for those two, and about half an hour later at present, Suzy and Tino are allowed to go out. IF one hasn't been seen for about 20 mins, we shout at the door then go and try and find them. The door tends to get shut about 8pm at the moment, but that will get extended as the nights get lighter. Only Sam causes me any issues at the moment. I dont normally have so many fosters with outdoor access, but the boys are living their life out here, and the girls have been here so long they were getting fed up indoor only.

[Bazsmum]

Well looks like I cant just get away with eating popcorn this time! 

Right you bunch of hot heads you......  

When I wrote this quote below....and the point is? (post 24) I was referring to CC's post (post 23) as she had put her quotes in and give no response....

She then modified her post to answer the quotes and then replied to me saying that Harry had posted before she got chance to write (post 25)


Now for one of my fave smileys.......  

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

I think reading the posts rather than the poll is better cos mine free roam and I ve not done the poll because I believe the cat and the home circumstances have to be taken into account.

I think some are viewing indoor stimulation  versus outdoor stimulation in rather a blinkered way cos the two are very different and am sure that it was not meant that anyone did not provided enough indoor stimulation for indoor only cats but indoors they cant act as they do outside and pounce on things in the grass and watch the birds over head perching and tormenting which stimulates the cats natural hunting mode. Which is then cut off abriptly as the bird flies.................no wonder cats love da birdy so much 

My cats act very different indoors to outside cos there is so much more space and they just love to sit in the late night air, watching and waiting 

During the day they can have games with the grass and the leaves, dig holes and hide behind things, just a world apart from inside.

However I would never force or even lift a cat outside if it didnt want to go and if I open the door and they run away indoors and hide, thats fine, they can be inside if they want.

Both birmans moreorless stay in the bedroom all the time now, occasionally they will venture downstairs and even outside but very rare. Franta is having a phase of wanting to play bedmice but Ducha just eats and sleeps and potters about.

I think the main thing is that every cat is different and where they live is different too, so one must just pick what is best for what the cat likes and needs. 

[Tiggy's Mum]

BTW, no-one and I mean no-one thinks, or means to give the impression they think, that Lucas and Riley (God forbid) have been mistreated except perhaps once or twice maybe on the feeding front 

Hey, that was below the belt - they haven't missed a meal in weeks 

[Rosella moggy]

Whoops the cat proofed gardens didn't even register with me. Sorry!     You are right though Helen, generally (ignoring us crazy Purrs cat peeps  ) the inclination is to allow free roaming although that doesn't mean it's right or wrong.  Purrs peeps do what we think best for our puds 

BTW, no-one and I mean no-one thinks, or means to give the impression they think, that Lucas and Riley (God forbid) have been mistreated except perhaps once or twice maybe on the feeding front 

[Tiggy's Mum]

Does it not seem a bit odd that poll indicates a preference for "free to roam" but posts seem to be more the other way?  Come on "free to roamers", let's hear ya!     

Depends how you interpret the results though 26 have said indoor only or catproofed garden so they would all count as NON FREE ROAMERS yet just 17 have opted for FREE ROAMING.  Have to say I'm a bit surprised by the results so far as I would have thought there were more free roamers, that's what I would have thought is 'the norm' - I guess that goes to show thta Purrs people are certainly not normal 

It doesn't follow of course that I think others with indoor only puds are mistreating them   

Exactly    I think the tone of some previous posts suggested that, whether intentionally or not...

[Rosella moggy]

Does it not seem a bit odd that poll indicates a preference for "free to roam" but posts seem to be more the other way?  Come on "free to roamers", let's hear ya!      

It's a hard one but me and OH prefer to allow 24/7 indoor/outdoor access; however having young, senseless, fearless, footballing kittens makes you concentrate more on this question though  

Twas a sight to behold young Millie tonight showing off her footballing skills   She put Ruby with her extra toes to shame. She's obviously been practising    I mentioned on another thread earlier that I look forward to and dread with equal measure the day they 1st go outside.  There's not really sufficient room inside to let them properly fly after Da Mousey  

I lived in a flat for 13 years during which my (at that point) 2 puds had very restricted outdoor access. I couldn't wait to get a house (chosen very much with puds in mind) where they could have outdoor access, albeit not 100% safe. The one that was still with me when we moved loved going out in her new garden.  The choice was always hers as it is with our older puds now.  I suppose me and OH have decided that, given the choice, we believe our puds would prefer to go outside and run the risks that entails.  We had one pud Gandolf who threw himself at the window within minutes of 1st being let out of basket (he had been locked up at RSPCA for 6 months)  

It doesn't follow of course that I think others with indoor only puds are mistreating them    All puds are different and young uns are esp prone to harm outside.  Our 2 young tearways are over 4 months old and were happy as sandpipers watching the older ones (through the window) playing in the garden with us on Sunday.  I just don't see that as a long term thing as our house is in a relatively cat "safe" area.

[Zenith (Liz)]

My two were young like Helens and never knew too much about the outside so they've never known what they are 'missing'.  I clip them into harnesses and take them out with my supervision, but they don't scratch at the doors and windows to be outdoors otherwise.  When outside all they do is chew grass even though I have trays of grass inside as well.

I recently found out the lady who lived here before me had one cat killed by a car, and the other one was hit by a car too and lost his leg.  I don't trust where I live in this area as I back onto a carpark.

I understand everyone's entitled to an opinion but i almost find it upsetting that it's implied I don't provide enough stimulation for my cats by keeping them indoors.  Material possesions aren't everything I know but Kirst has visited my house and seen the cat trees and hidey holes I have for mine along with a bucketload of interactive toys which we play with daily ( Nova's currently sitting on my lap trying to stop me typing  )

If Mia and Nova showed signs of wanting to go out i'd possibly reconsider but right now we're all happy with how things are.


I could also talk about my mums cat being bullied outside and having issues with other cats.  She's better now they have the microchipped catflap to prevent the cats attacking her in the house but she's nervous all the time.  She sprayed on my bag at the weekend to scentmark it  

[JackSpratt]

I think I always base my opinion on a cat that has already been outside in all honesty. My cats have always been allowed outside, so it's difficult for me to imagine them being happy any other way.

[Tiggy's Mum]

I agree that changing a cats environment from indoor/outdoor to indoor only would be very difficult, but when a cat hasn't experienced the outdoors to suggest that they are deprived of adequate mental stimulation purely because they do not have outdoors access is wrong in my opinion.

[JackSpratt]

I still feel that to be accurate, Helen. No amount of toys are ever going to give a cat the same stimulation as nature itself. Sorry, like I said just my opinion. I know for a fact that Jack would be really unhappy if I decided to change my cats lifestyles to indoor only, and the other three like having the option too.

[Tiggy's Mum]

Helen, you see no difference in your cats now and before you let them out? That's wonderful - it means you were giving them sufficient mental stimulation before and they get to go in the garden as an added bonus.

None whatsoever - they were just as happy, content and stimulated then as they are now. Earlier on you suggested it simply wasn't possible, my boys are proof that it is 

The point is, that no amount of toys will ever mimic what a cat can encounter in a positive way outside. Just an opinion, and one I hold with strongly. I do understand there are circumstances which require a cat to be kept indoors but purely because someone wants to isn't enough to me.

Yes, I want my cats to be safe; but I also want to know they're getting everything they require. And that includes mental stimulation as well.

[JackSpratt]

Sorry, I know some people are really defensive about this subject so was making sure people knew it wasn't an attack!

Robbo, I agree it is a cats individual personality that indicates whether they will mind being an indoor only cat.

Helen, you see no difference in your cats now and before you let them out? That's wonderful - it means you were giving them sufficient mental stimulation before and they get to go in the garden as an added bonus.

[Tiggy's Mum]

We're all entitled to an opinion, I was just giving mine. I'm not alone in this point and view and the people that keep their cats in are not alone in theirs. I didn't condemn anyone as cruel or inhumane - I just had an opinion. Apologies if it was offensive.

No one said you weren't entitled to an opinion JS and I certainly don't find your views offensive . Nobody has suggested you have condemned them as 'cruel or inhumane' either so I'm not sure where that came from. 

I was asking the question as I am in the unusual position of having indoor cats who were subsequently are allowed out (in a safe controlled manner) so my opinion is based on an actual real life situation where I saw that their life wasn't happier or more fulfilled simply due to having outdoor access.

[Robbo]

i think this also depends on the behaviour of your cat, like humans we all like different things, and we should all try and provide on what your cat needs or wants, if it isnt interested in out side why make it, i dont like being made to do things i dont want to do.  as long as the cats are well cared for and happy all is good i think....

[JackSpratt]

We're all entitled to an opinion, I was just giving mine. I'm not alone in this point and view and the people that keep their cats in are not alone in theirs. I didn't condemn anyone as cruel or inhumane - I just had an opinion. Apologies if it was offensive.

[Liz]

Cats are fairly adaptable to their situation - we adopted 3 ferals from a colony last year - the rest were posioned and Miss Cissy i  now 15 and has spent her first winter in the warmth and wants for nothing and is a happy soul - she previousl;y lived outside all her life - we also have her 2 kittens aged 8 Ragamuffin and Smudger and again they show no interest in going out, they live and sleep in my study upstairs but have the full run of the house at night.  We have now discovered Miss Cissy is deaf so its a good thing we love our ferals and always never say never where they are concerned.

Our dearly detparted Bertie went Blind at 18 and moved with teh rest of the then 37 clan members to a new house, he mastered the garden and could get up a fair lick of speed on sunny days when he didn't want to come back in before we went to work, he also mastered stairs and a house twice the size of our last one.

we have a 3 legged hooligan who is faster from a standing start than some of the 4 footed, whilst we live in a very rural location we now have the wilder beaties to consider - badgers, foxes etc

The cats have also trained our 2 Border Collies in the sport of nose shredding should they get to close and want to round them up and next doors Lab and Alsation have learned not to chase the Clan Cats - shredded noses will apply!

We work hard to ensure neither part of our family want for anything and as our vet says all are a credit to us as they are hale and hearty we even are putting up with Beijing calling - all our boys are done so she can hopefully come through her speying without the dreaded Corona virus mutating and the older she is the better chance she has unlike her poor late Mum Gem who died from FIP.

We have traffic on our track but the potholes that have developed over the winter have really slowed everthing down to first gear if you want to keep your shock absorbers working!!!!!

[Janeyk]

I forgot to mention our ferals, they are all still here we haven't lost one to the roads and although they are outside they are in a safe area, I presume why the CP said to release them back here.

[nicchick]

My two are indoor only. We have small gardens and a fairly busy road at the front. I would love to cat proof the garden but the fences are falling down so we would have to pay for new fences as well, so for now its not an option financially but absolutely definately something for the future.

My older boy we let out with supervision for about half an hour every so often - he never leaves the garden and always runs in the house if a neighbour appears! He is VERY VERY timid, but he does enjoy a short wander outdoors occasionally. He meows and takes us to the back door on the very odd occasion he wants to go out, which is usually if its really sunny but then only on average every couple of weeks.

We have a new kitten - she is so inqusitive and absolutely fearless and tries to eat everything - I just know she would get into trouble so there is no way Im going to let her out unless she trys to get out. So far though she has shown no desire to go outdoors.

Whilst I keep mine indoors they are both IMO very happy - we have quite a large house, big climbing frames and they get lots of play. If my two wanted regular outdoor access I would have to have a rethink, but at the moment it all works fine.

nic

[CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls]

What I do for one  (Harry) I can not do for the others, especially Macey. Macey is totally senseless on the roads and anywhere outside to be honest. So I have to keep her in for her own safety. So thats me keeping her in regardless of her wanting to go out. I just couldn't risk it with her ad Im not willing to take a chance on the off chance she wants to bring a piece of grass home lol 

I would say out of my lot there is only Ted and Harry who get miffed that they cant go out. The others just accept it. And no I dont think they are missing anything from not having free range 

[Tiggy's Mum]

I do understand there are circumstances which require a cat to be kept indoors but purely because someone wants to isn't enough to me.

What if someone 'wants to' purely because they won't expose them to the general risks that are out there: Cars, evil humans, theft, dogs/foxes, the risk of straying... My boys are fit and healthy and according to your criteria (opinion) I was wrong to keep them as indoors for the first year of their lives - they were happy, content, stimulated and loved. 

Even now I have the catproofed garden they still only go out for short periods and I can say, hand on heart, that whilst they do enjoy going out they are no happier now that they have outdoor access than when they were completely indoor only - outdoor access isn't the be all and end all in my opinion.

[JackSpratt]

My lot dont fit the poll, they can go out when its light, not in a proofed garden, neither are they allowed to roam free, they have outdoor time when theres someone home and they are encouraged to stay in the garden which they generally do.
Iv picked up too many rta cats to let them do whatever, if it was my house i would adpat it and they would have a catproofed garden.

I do understand there are circumstances which require a cat to be kept indoors but purely because someone wants to isn't enough to me.

Aslong as the cat is ok with being in whats the problem? In Robbos case there are circumstances eg a busy road so sophie sounds like shes better off indoors away from that.

MM, I did specify it was my opinion. I'm of the belief that a cat benefits from outdoor time unless it has a health disability that might cause it to be slower to react to a dangerous situation or if the owners are living near a main road. As i said, it's just my opinion, i don't think someone is a negligent owner for making a decision based on caring about their cat.

[Wibblechick]

Ours are outside under supervision - we are at the top of a block of flats so its a bit awkward for them to come and go freely (not to mention unsafe)  They do have access to the balcony pretty much on demand though - in the summer the door is open 24/7    And if the door isnt open?  They have trained their human slaves to open it for them

[Liz]

The Clan Cats come in to 3 Catergories

The Inside only crew - at our choice - ferals in domestication mode, several have moved on through the familyroom door and of course Beijing and Archie the kittens - Archie shows no interest in being outside but did spend the weekend in the conservatory - supervised of course, beijing will be indoor/outdoor once she is speyed as she loves her half hour rambles on a sat/Sun Morning - Of the ferals most are happy to be inside - they don't look to go out and even mopve themmselves through to the right side of the door first thing in the morning

We then have the indoor/outdoor crew who have free reign to come and go as they please from 06.00am to 20.00pm and all except Rogue are in by that time - they sem to have a clock to advise you should be home by now!  Rogue is a feral and comes in when its dark!   

Finally we have the outdoor only ferals who love their food and warm places in the garage and wendy house but have no inclination for human contact all bar 2 boys still to be done until some other idiots dump there cats in the woods again!

[The Duchess]

my 2 are indoors during the day when we're out at work and allowed out at weekends but only when we're around.  In the summer and when the evenings are light, we let them out for a couple of hours after work.  They're never allowed out if we're not around and are always kept in at night.  They're not allowed out the front (road!) but are free to roam the back gardens - and they do

Jessie doesn't go far - she just likes sitting under the hedge or in the flower beds; Cosmo has to patrol the surrounding gardens to make sure they're "safe".  He's not a very good guard cat tho' as there's a huuuuge black & white fluff monster that keeps coming into our garden - he then appreciates having his daddy around to scare of said intruder

Personally, I know Cosmos would love to be out more/longer but that's just not possible at the moment - I really do think that everyone has to make their own decision based on individual circumstances!

 



 

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

I would think most problems happen through the day when there is more traffic, it really makes me cringe when I see cats near roads and it can be dangerous for the drivers.  I know it can be difficult if you have a cat who wants to be out all the time, our very first cat Penny was like that so thankfully she was safe outside here, I know when we have been looking at houses the first thing we say is oh we wouldn't be able to have cats here, too near roads and we really wouldn't I'd never rest.

Ironically things happen when its quieter often, cos cats thinks its safe and the odd vehicles travel too fast and without looking cos not much traffic around.

Mine all are free to roam but only in the back and there is a field at the back too,,,,,,,,,,,,,,I had kittens a couple of years ago cos saw Sasa across the road at the front....think she had been scared by a visitor cat and had just ran. Was very lucky cos managed to get her back across the road and overr the wall again, I was so scared cos she is a semi feral and will run if anyone approaches her. Just as bad was Misa who was perched about 7 ft up  on top of the gate watching Sasa, alll this was very late at night in the dark.

I think you have to take in the nature of your cat and the area you live in and try to come to a decision that you will be the happiest with.......not doing poll

[Millys Mum]

My lot dont fit the poll, they can go out when its light, not in a proofed garden, neither are they allowed to roam free, they have outdoor time when theres someone home and they are encouraged to stay in the garden which they generally do.
Iv picked up too many rta cats to let them do whatever, if it was my house i would adpat it and they would have a catproofed garden.

I do understand there are circumstances which require a cat to be kept indoors but purely because someone wants to isn't enough to me.

Aslong as the cat is ok with being in whats the problem? In Robbos case there are circumstances eg a busy road so sophie sounds like shes better off indoors away from that.

[Susanne (urbantigers)]

My boys are both indoor only.

[Robbo]

I would rather know she is nice and safe at home waiting for me :-)

What about if it becomes apparant no amount of toys would make Sophie content to be an indoor only cat? Sorry to be abrupt, but I agree with Debsymiller. Yes, I want my cats to be safe; but I also want to know they're getting everything they require. And that includes mental stimulation as well.

But if my cat or any cat has never been outside surely it doesn't know what it's missing?

If you never ate choch in your life would you get the urge for it or miss it?

....and the point is??? 

The point is, that no amount of toys will ever mimic what a cat can encounter in a positive way outside. Just an opinion, and one I hold with strongly. I do understand there are circumstances which require a cat to be kept indoors but purely because someone wants to isn't enough to me.

[JackSpratt]

I would rather know she is nice and safe at home waiting for me :-)

What about if it becomes apparant no amount of toys would make Sophie content to be an indoor only cat? Sorry to be abrupt, but I agree with Debsymiller. Yes, I want my cats to be safe; but I also want to know they're getting everything they require. And that includes mental stimulation as well.

....and the point is??? 

The point is, that no amount of toys will ever mimic what a cat can encounter in a positive way outside. Just an opinion, and one I hold with strongly. I do understand there are circumstances which require a cat to be kept indoors but purely because someone wants to isn't enough to me.

[Gillian Harvey]

Mine all go outside, I wouldnt have it any other way. They are free to roam pretty much, although apart from Harry they mostly stay in the garden. Overnight they can still go outside into a couple of areas that are catproofed and can be closed off from the rest of the garden, so they can still come and go as they please, but not roam at night.   

[Bonkers Mad!!!]

mine are allowed out but had i known when i first got cats that it was possible to keep them in i would have.  i get them in before it gets dark as i panic easily if they aren't in beforehand.  if one isnt in then i have to stay up until i know they are all safe.  i'm finding it really hard with the last 2 kittens.  Merlin was "done" in february but i still havent let him out even though he's desperate for freedom.  Mouse will be "done" next month but i can already tell that he'll be a stay at home cat.  out of the 11 that do go out only 3 venture out of the garden.  they go over the back and spend their days laying on top of somebody avary  .  the rest stay in the garden, not far from the back door.

[Robbo]

Well she never tries to get out when I go in or out the house and to be honest I would consider her being more healthy inside that going out with all the risks out there, I live bear a main road for a start, people where I live are mostly idiots, I'd rather her be content inside as she has never been outdoors before, then run the risks of my nearby areas