Swampy has a lump on his salivary gland

[pappilon]

Its a lovely day today, i hope swampy enjoys it.

[swampmaxmum]

No I know he's got high bp but the meds affect his liver. I was looking at the results again and the liver results are now at the top end of normal, where in the last 2 tests they were lower. So he can't take bp meds.
Thanks everyone for your support for the Swamp and his neurotic mum. Enjoy the sun   

[Desley (booktigger)]

Am glad his bloods weren't too bad - but I wouldnt let the vet dismiss his blurry vision to old age, high blood pressure can affect the retinas (but can also be reversible). Fingers crossed you can find a routine that helps him

[Maddiesmum]

Bless him.  Glad he didn't need the Fortekor and glad he is eating albeit with encouragement

[pappilon]

I do hope Swampy feels better and stay well. And thankyou for your kind words for Boy, he is going in tomorrow and i hope the B12 helps him.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Maybe you can fins away of creating steps so he can get to the sun with a firmly fixed bed with sides so he can feel safe.

Hope Swampy stays well 

[swampmaxmum]

He loves sunshine, it's his all time fav thing to sit in canned sun. In South Africa, he used to find it too hot and come indoors and lie in a patch of sun  Trouble is, our top flat under the eaves has small windows so in a month or so, no more sun will come in. Before, not a prob as he could jump up near the kitchen window and sit on the sill, but now that no longer appeals as he doesn't feel safe.
yes, it's Vivitonin - vet is holding off for the minute unless Swamp's dementia symptoms worsen, as he's unsure with his liver and with him being a cat not a dog!

Blood tests aren't too bad compared to last time so no Fortekor as yet - we'll continue with renal food, alu caps binders (if tolerated) and assess in 3 months, all things being equal. He's concerned about potential anaemia (Swampy can't have steroid injections cos of his liver) so he's going on to a foul tasting blue muck called Visorbin. I've been reading the CRF bible site on B12 and may ask about that (Methylcobalamin) when I can.
Today he's had 4 meals, each in 4 different locations and ending with my feeding him as much off the spoon as off his plate    but at least he's eaten a bit and the bloods are not too bad. Just urea, white cells and the iron thing are not really too wonderful.

[Maddiesmum]

Is it vivitonin the vet wants to put Swampy on for the mental deterioration>?  My dog was on it for a long time and it helped her.

Might be worth trying a very low dose of Fortekor.  You know what his reaction was last time so can quickly stop them if it starts again.  I am sorry you are having such a worrying time and hope he enjoys the sunshine.

[swampmaxmum]

Senior nurse was there and trainee vet and vet - so they took him away and got bloods from him. Results tonight or tomorrow. I must try to get some SEB down him and try Alu Caps to see if he tolerates that any better than Ipaketine.
The vet wants us to try a 1/2 or even a 1/4 dose Fortekor if the kidney readings are bad.  He's thinking about some meds which are actually for dogs to help them with alzheimers/senior moments as thinks the anxiety could be part of a mental deterioration. Or there's Vita -something (or is it the same? Head as cloudy as the fog this am).  Couldn't take his bp as it would have been sky high; I just hope his restlessness isn't that it's very high. He did look in Swampy's eyes and says his vision must be a bit blurry - again, old age.
Thank God the sun is out. My boy ate well when he came home (nothing like a 14 hour fast I suppose!) and seems to feel a bit better when NOT on meds to 'help' him.

Unfortunately he has to have routine bloods every few months as the liver disease could re-occur and we need to know early (so many meds are metabolised through the liver; one week of 1/2 dose Istin made his ALT rise alarmingly).

PS 3 weeks and no change in the mouth lump so please please please.......!!!! be ok.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Poor Swampy, I hope all goes well on Monday 

I am just wondering but do you really need the bloods done cos it obviously stresses him out so much. Will they tell you anything that will help...........sorry just sorta thinking aloud.

[Maddiesmum]

Well I am glad he is managing to eat something.  Poor little soul is obviously feeling vulnerable (Dragan was like that) and I really don't blame you for being worried about the Fortekor.  I hope he picks up and best of luck on Monday.  Keeping you both in my thoughts 

[swampmaxmum]

Yes he had total lethargy, just lying there and diarrhoea on the normal dose of Fortekor and after 2 weeks I took him off it. The vet is evangelical about Fortekor. I know they aren't as keen on it in America and I wonder why. I know some or a lot of cats do really well on it, but we'll see. Perhaps I will try a half dose, but I am scared of a repeat of last time, only worse as Swampy's health is worse than last time. We'll see what the bloods show.
have been battling and he's been bravely eating little bits of renal food today but on top of the boiler or off the back of a spoon and always anxiously looking up after every lick for 'predators'. He refused to eat fresh chicken so I think it's processed food if anything.  He's not purring constantly so I don't think he's in pain, just feeling off colour.

[Desley (booktigger)]

Fingers crossed for Mon - and without wanting to sound negative, do be aware that cats also purr to comfort themselves, so it isn't always a sign they are happy.

[Maddiesmum]

Sorry to read Swampy not so good.  You say you can't do Fortekor is that because Swampy reacted like Dragan did?  Did you mention it to your vet?  I seem to remember he was having similar symptoms to Dragan but forgive me because at the time I was really emotionally bad and didn't take everything in.  Sometimes the side effects do fade after a week but obviously if Swampy's are as bad as Dragan's were then you don't want the same thing to happen.

Whatever I hope he picks up over the weekend and good luck at the vet on Monday.  Come on Swampy. 

[swampmaxmum]

Swampy isn't too good at the moment. Apart from eating his i/d in the morning (plate of it), it is a struggle and I am now having to try all sorts of tricks like the back of a spoon. His coat's glossy but he has little interest in eating. I put him back on the Ipaketine but at a far lower dose and wondered if that was making him feel iffy, as his tum's been affected by it. I think I won't give it tomorrow and see if it makes any diffs. he normally eats 2 breakfasts about an hour apart, but brekker 2 was roundly ignored this morning. He's also very agitated, looking around for predators and I'm having to constantly reassure him. Last night we were watching TV and I had to go and sit with him to calm him (he can't react to voice as is stone deaf). The decline seems rapid and I am worried.

Max is not lying with him any more either. Normally they always curl up together and have several baths a day. Some of Max's attitude could be jealousy as Swampy's needs mean that he gets more attention but maybe not all.
So if I can't do Fortekor and can't do Ipaketine (or binders: haven't yet tried the Alu caps as wanted to talk to the vet first on monday), we'll just have to let things take their course. He still purrs quite a bit so that is a comfort. Sorry to offload - just a week ago he was eating ok. Anyhow, Swampy's due to have his bloods done on Monday morning. Just hope they manage it this time as feel it's very necessary.
have a lovely weekend -at least around here there is some sun for the elderlies to lie in and zzzz

[Maddiesmum]

Hi

My vet did not consult the manufacturer but the decline was so rapid and the day he did not have the Fortekor he perked up that that was the only conclusion possible.  It also says on the leaflet that this can happen in rare cases. 

[swampmaxmum]

Thanks - again, not sure what I'd do without all of you lovely catslaves  . Waiting for news or to watch for changes isn't easy.

Maddiesmum, sorry to ask at this awful time for you, but did your vet actually speak to Novartis about Dragan's terrible reaction to Fortekor or is it his opinion that weakness and listlessness are dangerous side effects, maybe based on several cases? My vet ( I do understand why, as he sees it helping so many cats) is evangelical about Fortekor.  He seems to be blaming me for my caution, although I think he does understand it because of the Torbugesic Episode. Plus Swampy went beserk after an anaesthetic to remove a lump while in France. We had to keep the flat's windows shut in the summer there because he was trying to jump out, he was mad. Thank God that only lasted 12 hours or so, but they'd not seen a reaction like that before either.
It's not all drugs though as Destolit (human drug used experimentally for cat liver disease) worked like a charm.  Don't think Novartis will talk to a mere peasant (me), just a vet.

Anyhow the plan is to see what the lump is; then if it is ok we do blood tests and depending on them we decide on Fortekor, maybe at a reduced dose. This is going to be a tricky month.

[Desley (booktigger)]

Aww, fingers crossed for him.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

I agree you are very wise to be cautious and to be honest I dont think I would put him through that again as he has already had side effects. I hope that the news is good about the lump and that it is not serious, thinking of you and Swampy 

[Maddiesmum]

The weak and lifelessness is what alerted me to Dragan's plight.  He eventually lost all sensation in his back legs.  He was so weak that at one point, whilst eating his dinner, he just lay in it and fell asleep.  Please keep an eye on Swampy (silly thing to say as I know you will) but it is rare.  Best of luck and please keep us posted re the Fortekor.  He certainly is one in a million as was my buddy boy

[swampmaxmum]

thanks Maddiesmum for thinking of us when you're going through so much xxx. Swampy was very weak, lifeless and just lay there and was also off his food. I kept him on it for 2 weeks, then decided not to continue as he was really ill, diarrhoea even etc. If I agree again it will be to test if it has any effect on his constant snorting cold, which is worrying him. The vet thinks lower urea = cold symptoms will improve. Plus would only do it if that lump isn't a tumour as if it is, there's no point.  If I do do it, he will have to be free of horrible side effects or I'll stop it. He's been through so much since 2004 with a major drama a year! Not fair. I can also measure him against my Max, who took Fortekor with no side effects at all. The vet says no cats except Swampy have side effects, which can't be true and of course isn't true. Any drug can have side effects on individuals. Vet does know Swamp has 'funny' reactions to certain drugs - he got nearly fatal liver collapse from a sedative, Torbugesic, which is apparently safe and harmless in (acc to the vet) 999 999 out of 1 million cats!
I knew my boy was one in a million/zillion - obviously in many ways 

[Maddiesmum]

Swampmaxmum, I had to have my Dragan put to sleep due to the adverse reaction to Fortekor.  The vet said they shouldn't be lifeless, weak and sleepy, the only side effect they would expect is for them to go off their food.  Don't want to be a  harbinger of doom but you are right to be cautious.

[Sam (Fussy_Furball)]

Ahhh poor Swampy sending lots of love and hugs to you both 

[swampmaxmum]

Both of us went in (OH too). Swampy was very unco-operative and wouldn't keep his mouth open, but OH thinks he knows where to look - of course if it grows, we'll see it easily. The vet took advantage of OH's being there to insist that as soon as we know what the lump is (a month or so, if it's ok), we must put Swampy on Fortekor again as he's sure his cold etc is from toxins and urea in his body. It's so difficult a decision as he was so lifeless and ill on it before. Vet still can't decide if a lower dose would be effective. First things first. Thanks for your messages of support  everyone. Swamp is not feeling well today and is refusing to purr. Think the tum's not good as normally when we come back from the vet he eats well.

[clarenmax]

Best of luck 

[Dawn F]

good luck

[Mark]

Good luck today 

[Maddiesmum]

Good luck tomorrow 

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Good luck tomorrow 

[gibraltarcat]

Keeping everything crossed for Swampy and sending  and headbutts.

[swampmaxmum]

He's back to the vet early tomorrow morning. I emailed my questions and he rang me at last! Turns out though that the small swelling on Swamp's mouth that I've been monitoring isn't the salivary gland lump, which is right at the back of his mouth (shows what I know). So he's going to have another look and show us just where it is. Not so easy to check as Swamp hates having his mouth opened. We're both very nervous as the vet confirmed that IF it is a tumour, it is completely untreatable.

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Lots of good wishes for Swampy 

[swampmaxmum]

Still haven't got hold of the vet and have now been told to send an email with my questions (so I will).  Swamp's also feeling off colour from Ipaketine which has given him a hard, swollen tum and quite a few fruitless visits to the tray (or one where just a marble comes out).  I hesitate to start another thread for him but has anyone else has this problem with Ipaketine causing tum problems?
Swamp has IBD from his liver disease but he's been doing well on lactulose. Another q to add to my emailed list.

[Desley (booktigger)]

AWw, I do hope it is nothing too serious.

[gibraltarcat]

Sending big  to you and Swampy and praying that all will be well.

[lucy]

Hoping for the best! 

[Mark]

thanks for your support  . The vet said he could only tell from a proper biopsy, which would mean an op. Swampy's too high risk for an anaesthetic. So we have to wait and see instead. The vet thought that Swampy's increasingly worsening blocked nose and coldy snorting was from toxins in his body from his CRF. Now he thinks that it may be from this too.

Mine was done with a local anaesthetic  from inside my cheek and they stitched it up - but I guess my mouth is a lot bigger than Swampy's 

Just hoping for the best for him 

[Tiggy's Mum]

Oh no    I really hope it's nothing sinister, thinking of you and Swampy 

[Maddiesmum]

Poor Swampy and poor you.  Hope it turns out not to be a tumour. 

[swampmaxmum]

thanks for your support  . The vet said he could only tell from a proper biopsy, which would mean an op. Swampy's too high risk for an anaesthetic. So we have to wait and see instead. The vet thought that Swampy's increasingly worsening blocked nose and coldy snorting was from toxins in his body from his CRF. Now he thinks that it may be from this too.