Renal problems - any tips?

[swampmaxmum]

Does TJ like Hills wet K/d as mine did prefer it to the RC pouches. Online buying will be cheaper, even allowing for the p&p. I mostly used vet uk but there are others too.

Tanya's CRF website is so brilliant when things get more difficult in the later stages and UK vets are usually behind the pace on what to do to be honest.  There's a yahoo group linked to it, which is mostly but not exclusively americans, and you may like to join that to get advice for TJ and a lot of emotional support for yourself too. I don't know what I'd have done without both it and of course Purrs.

I would second the binder in food thing but Renalzin may be better if TJ doesn't like Ipakitine and/or if his calcium is a bit on the high side as it's made from shellfish and has calcium in it. Renalzin's a pump that you squirt into the food, doesn't seem to taste bad (not that I've tried it  ). There's also aluminium hydroxide which (I think) is the cheapest binder that a lot of americans use.

The key to CRF it seems is diet and adequate hydration so wet food seems a better idea than dry as it's mostly water and you can add water to it too. When you next see the vet, ask him or her to show you how to check TJ's hydration - the scruff of the neck skin fold should go back quickly if it's fine.
I found I couldn't read the whole of Tanya's site at once but what I did was use the 'search' facility for anything I was worried about at the time. It's also a very comforting site as shows you just how much can be done to slow and control the disease.

I'm sorry TJ has CRF but don't panic Nikki as he could do well for a very long time yet. 

[Corporal Smokey]

Josh will only eat dry and the RC has pulled his numbers right down too. I have a Drinkwell fountain and I think that's made a huge difference as they really like drinking from it.

My local chemist, Manor Pharmacy do RC Renal for around £15. Think that might just be a Derbyshire thing but you may find a local chemist that does a similar thing.

The way I see CRF is that a cat only has a finite time on Earth anyway so don't ever see it as a death sentence, you're just helping the last years (which can as Mark has said be many long happy ones) be as healthy as possible. My vet said at worst CRF cats just feel a little nausea and may seem a little run down now and again but they pick back up and carry on.

I might try these binders. We're due for another round of bloods soon so I'll ask the vet then, thanks for the tip Mark!

[Desley (booktigger)]

Well, as I say, it has got Zi's numbers down, she eats less than a pouch of wet a day (she never touched wet before coming here). It does have incredibly low phosphorus, although they dont say low protein.

[Mark]

I don't know if that is entirely true as I read that cats generally don't have a strong thirst mechanism. Should they really wait until they feel thirsty to get fluids? - I personally wouldn't take an opinion from one vet as gospel. Clapton drinks a lot but I still always add a splosh of water to it.

[Desley (booktigger)]

Interestingly, I was talking to someone on CC yesterday, and this was posted: Interestingly, Nick had recently been to a talk by a vet who is an expert in feline CRF and she said the renal dry food has been found to be just as good as the wet, and that cats simply drink more to compensate.

I have to say, Zi ate renal wet for 5 weeks, and since then has had a mix of renal/senior dry and adult wet with no binders, and her numbers have come down, despite being on daily Metacam.

[Michelle (furbabystar)]

He's currently on royal canin renal food but costs £18 per 2kg bag from the vet.  Where's the best place to get it?

Thats about the right price tbh
VetUK is cheaper but then theres the P&P

If controlled, cats with CRF can do really well. Loads of people on here have cats with it
Good luck, I'm sure you still have many years ahead xx

[Desley (booktigger)]

I would definitely try him eating more wet than dry, it is much better for them. My CRF girl gets adult wet and renal/senior dry and her numbers have come down - she can't have Fortekor due to being on Metacam, and I haven't bothered with phosphorus binders as her phosphorus is low anyway. She does get some renal/senior wet, but not a lot as she never ate wet food before coming here, and there are only certain ones I can get her to eat.

[clarenmax]

The websites can be overwhelming, and I think I caused myself more worry with Max by reading it all in one go, it made me really paranoid 

It is the definitive bible though, and combined with advice on here, did see me through all the questions I had.

Max had a mixture of wet and dry food, if he wouldn't eat his renal wet pouches, I gave him senior with Ipakinine, same as Mark has already suggested.  If they won't eat the renal food, then you just have to do the next best thing I found.

My boy never had any actual treatment for his CRF, he had thyroid issues too which combined do make the conditions harder to treat, but there is always a balance.

[Mark]

A lot of people think that dry renal food so wrong because basically, they need to flush toxins out with water. Clapton eats 99% wet food but still drinks gallons.

I think the wet is a safer bet and I am also against forcing cats to eat things they hate - btw renal wet is expensive + it smells horrible and probably 1 pouch in 12 gets eaten. Although he chops & changes, his favourite at the moment is Felix senior. It is often on offer in Sainsbury's, 2 boxes for £5. There are 8 flavours as they sell 2 different boxes. Whiskas also sell a mixed in jelly senior box, a mixed fish senior box and a mixed in gravy box so there is plenty of choice. There is aguide somewhere on Tanyas site that shows senior food has about 30% less phosphorus than adult food so when you add binders, it will bring the levels down even more. I also allow clapton chicke, beef, fish etc but I dust it in a measure of Ipakitine and he is fine with that 

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

Yes there is but its meant to be the bible of CRF and have most everything you need to know, so I guess you select the bits that you need. 

[Niklepic]

I did have a mooch at the advice but Mark's right there is a lot to take in.

T is in fairly early stages.   his blood readings were slightly high so vet suggested a change in diet to the renal food to see if he can maintain the readings. 

He is eating the dry but  has switched from all wet food.   He doesn't usually like dry and still seems pretty hungry when he's eaten (unless he's trying to guilt me into giving him his favourites) so might have a word with the vet re the binders. 

[Mark]

I find Tanya's CRF site overwhelming and there is far to much information to take in at once. It is the definitive guide though. Some sections are best not looked at.

Renal food is low protein and low phosphorus. There has been recent scientific evidence that low protein for cats isn't a good thing, due to the fact that cats are designed to eat a high protein, low carb diet. Low protein can actually cause muscle wastage but the petfood manufacturers are still making the diets low protein. However, quality protein is important - ie from meat & eggs. The snag is, meat contains phosphorus in quite high quantities. I buy a poweder from VetUK called Ipakitine. for £14, you get 150 measures, one mesure per meal which you can add to regular wet cat food. It is a phosphorus binder, which chemically reduces the amount of phosphorus the cat's body absorbs. I got approval from my vet before starting to use it but I think it is great. Obviously it os for you to make choices for your cat and not for me - but I would never do anything for Clapton that I thought would harm him. He hates renal food, so by using binders, I can give him his regular wet food that he likes. (he doesn't like dry - also it isn't a great idea to give cats with CRF a dry diet as they need as much fluid as they can get). It is better to use senior food if you can as it is lower in phosphorus than adult food.

Hope this makes sense.

You might opt for a mix of dry renal and wet food. VetUK sell Purina Renal dry (called Purina n/f) which is about £10 for 1.5kg. Some cats find it more palatable, in fact, 2 of mine that don't have CRF love it 

Hill's science plan also have a renal version (k/d) that smell quite meaty - again in my opinion, it is more palatable than Royal Canin - just going by smell that is 

[Gill (sneakiefeline)]

We have guides for various illnesses behing our link button at the top and here is the one for CRF

http://www.felinecrf.org/

[Mark]

Hi Nikki,

Firstly, try not to panic. Our Clapton was diagnosed 3 years, 5 months ago and is still going strong. Tom must be in really early stages for them to suggest just renal food as Clapton has been on meds as well as renal food since he was diagnosed. (he doesn't eat much so I give him senior or adult food with binders in) It is such a broad subject.

The cheapest place to buy renal food is VetUK and they charge £14.95

[Niklepic]

TJ (12 year old Tom) was diagosed with kidney disease last week.    We've been weaning him onto renal support food over the last few days and he seems to have picked up a little bit already.

He's currently on royal canin renal food but costs £18 per 2kg bag from the vet.  Where's the best place to get it?

I'm really paddling in the dark at the moment so if anyone has any info I'd be very grateful.  I'm going to stop googling because it's made me worry.

Many thanks

Nikki and TJ