Author Topic: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger  (Read 6645 times)

Offline swampmaxmum

  • Super Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 3070
  • SwampMax happy on their sunny French balcon 05!
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #34 on: January 06, 2009, 14:13:57 PM »
just a thought. I don't know what village or town the cattery is in. However if it is small, then your best bet may be to go along to the Mairie (town hall) with someone local in tow to explain. The Maires in small town or village France are immensely powerful and no-one messes with them. This is a social issue in his or her 'commune'. Take proof you have paid all outstanding amounts with you as well as any correspondence.

And seeing as though the cats have come from rabies free NZ and (if I've understood correctly) are only in this situation because of paperwork irregularities, work on DEFRA to get exemption from the rest of full quarantine for the 2 cats.

Offline sixfurballs

  • Senior Cat
  • ****
  • Posts: 475
  • Bronte, Dino, Huxley & Heidi
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #33 on: January 06, 2009, 11:09:46 AM »
I don't have the first clue about French Law other than I know its extremely complicated, convoluted and long winded. If their law is anything like our own in the UK I'm afraid it will be very difficult to just turn up and demand the cats back if these despicable people prove difficult about releasing them. Pets are considered property under the law of many countries. If you take your property and give it in to someone else's care and there is a dispute over bills then that service provider may have a right to a lien over the property until the dispute is resolved.

I really urge you to get some legal advice from a solicitor. You will specifically need a lawyer who either practices in French law or has an affiliate in France who can advise them on how to assist you. A french speaking UK solicitor will not be sufficient as they won't know or understand the French law enough to properly advise you.

Here is a list of UK firms from the Law Society website that also operate in France. You may want to try ringing the Law Society and see if they can put you in touch with someone. They won't offer any legal advice at the Law Society but should be able to help you find the right solicitor. Some of those on this list are very large UK firms.

http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/choosingandusing/findasolicitor/action=lawfirmsearch.law

In theory as these people have not provided regular accounts and invoices they should find it equally difficult to prove that you still owe them more money above and beyond what you can prove you have been regularly paying them.

As others have recommended I'd also seriously consider the assistance of animal welfare organisations in France who will know the regulatory framework for the cattery and what level of service they are required to provide.

I'm so sorry for the loss of Baby and really wish you all the best in getting you other two cats back.


Offline Canterbury_cats (Sharon)

  • Purrs Registered Cat Rescue
  • Super Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 2132
  • Leo(Bridge babe 4/10) & Bella my darling Siamese
    • http://www.canterbury.cats.org.uk
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #32 on: January 05, 2009, 08:32:02 AM »
You all seem to be offering great advice two things. Roger Gale is our local MP (although i have to say not a very good one) his wife Suzy Gale runs a charity Animals Worldwide and has its headquarters in Birchington kent. Its easy to Google and find..
One of our vets Roger Baker in Whitstable is on the Parlimentary cabinet on animal welfare as has Roger Gales ear some times... He has been involved in the animal welfare bill that went through parliment... You can search his practice (and email) via Roger Baker Vets Cromwell Rd, Whitstable Kent...
Not sure if any of this is use but they are people that have some say and may benefit having a few of them on your side with a view to speaking to local French authorities, however i WOULD ring CP legal department as they may have some clout!

Good luck
Cannot save the world, but if everyone does something we can have a jolly good job trying too....

Canterbury & District Cats Protection
http://www.canterbury.cats.org.uk

Please use our VetUK link on the Home Page of our website.
We want your old used inkjets & mobile phones!

Offline Janeyk

  • Rescue & Rehoming/Moderating Staff
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 21875
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #31 on: January 05, 2009, 07:15:42 AM »
I think I would have to get over there and demand my cats, isn't there someone with some authority who could go with you, surely they can't arrest you? also other people need to be made aware of them, just not sure how you'd go about this.
Please consider the harder to home cats in rescue.

Offline swampmaxmum

  • Super Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 3070
  • SwampMax happy on their sunny French balcon 05!
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #30 on: January 04, 2009, 11:23:55 AM »
http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/

you could try posting on that and hopefully someone will respond and help you in person when you go out. x

Google suggests that in Brittany (Bretagne as I'm sure you know) the Refuges are done by town, not necessarily bigger areas, eg this one for Brest/Finistere http://refugeplouzane.over-blog.org/

I would google for vets in the town where this couple's cattery is and give them a call and ask if "parlez vous anglais s'il vous plait, j'ai besoin de votre aide et je ne parle pas francais"* - make notes before hand of the key points as the story is complicated. I hope (I think you will) you find someone local to help you out.
* do you speak english please, I need your help and don't speak french.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2009, 11:29:03 AM by swampmaxmum »

Offline swampmaxmum

  • Super Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 3070
  • SwampMax happy on their sunny French balcon 05!
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #29 on: January 04, 2009, 11:04:45 AM »
Sorry, I'd not seen this thread before today. What an unbelievably dreadful story. France is very controlled when it comes to pets. There is a national feline register that (theoretically) has to register every cat in France with owner's name and address. I'd not ever used a cattery, so am not sure how regulated that is however. In the area we were in, the local animal welfare unit, which doubled as a boarding kennel too, was called the Refuge de...( the area) and the local one in Brittany may be able to assist. There is also the french SPA - in some departements they are the same organisation as the Refuge. In my view, you will need to go there in person (where do Ryanair go to? Brest?) and probably get help from someone local who speaks English or French (expat Brits are very numerous in Brittany).

There are expat forums which have Brittany as one of their areas. Some have dedicated 'pet' threads. I will check and repost the name and you could post your story and hopefully someone may help you.

I would not go to lawyers as french law (like here....worse maybe) is complex and the whole process would take years and cost a fortune, when you need instant action - unless you find good evidence of a criminal offence, in which case go to the police.

DEFRA (write to them with a clear email setting out the issue in detail and follow up with a phone call once they reply) may be able to help with the names of authorised animal handlers (companies) for the passport scheme who are french based as well as advise you on the procedure as it's got immensely complicated. Btw the french vet that wanted to revaccinate was probably sticking to their procedure where an animal has to be microchipped, then vaccinated, then 30 days later the bloods done and sent to the right authorised lab - french vets are terrified of UK passport procedures as they are insanely detailed and complicated. So that part of the vicious couple's story does ring true.  As Brittany has so many expats from the UK, it is very possible that you may find help from an english speaking vet in the area too.

My written french is a bit dodgy but if I can help you, I will. I don't suppose the UK consulate in Paris will be of much use, but there are animal welfare orgs in Paris too that may have someone who you could speak to in English.
The first step is to go there and take physical possession of the 2 cats I think and get them to somewhere safe. IF Monsieur and Madame Vicious won't hand over your cats, by all means involve the local authorities. Did you sign anything btw with this couple?
all the very best with this.


Offline Maddiesmum

  • Honorary Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 5853
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #28 on: January 03, 2009, 19:15:04 PM »
Some good advice there.  Hope that you can get it sorted soon it must be like living hell for you.  These people are disgusting

Offline Christine (Blip)

  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • ******
  • Posts: 12648
  • Blip
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #27 on: January 03, 2009, 17:05:31 PM »
You can fly to Brest with FlyBe from any of several regional airports and hire a car at the airport (you can pre-hire online too).  FlyBe is usually very reasonable and the flight is less than an hour from southern England, so much quicker than the ferry, especially at this time of year when the high-speed ferries aren't running.  Driving in Brittany is a doddle as the roads are good - and empty.
I'm a member of the British Humanist Association, the national charity supporting and representing people who seek to live good lives without religious or superstitious beliefs http://www.humanism.org.uk/home

Offline Sam (Fussy_Furball)

  • Marketing/Lost&Found/Moderating Staff
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 17472
  • Foxy (RIP), Zephyr (RIP), Rosina (RIP) & Oliver
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2009, 14:19:02 PM »
Well done Beanie for providing this assistance ... fingers crossed it'll help. 
In ancient times cats were worshiped as gods; they have not forgotten this.

Offline Beanie

  • Senior Cat
  • ****
  • Posts: 399
  • Beanie
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2009, 14:02:35 PM »
I have been doing a little political research over the last few months and hope that my information is not outdated.

Roger Gale is the MP for Thanet West who is part of the Conservative Animal Welfare Group. He along with the much lamented deceased MP Tony Banks have stuck their heads above the non-sexy political parapet of animal welfare issues.

Also on the Conservative Group of Animal Welfare MPs are Euro MPs - Neil Parrish, Struan Stevenson and Roger Helmer. In case you wonder why conservative? I did a little personal research a while ago on conservative MPs interested in animal welfare issues, as I noted that the party were fairly inconspicuous as signatories on parliamentary early day motions concerning such welfare compared to labour and the Lib Dems.

Your response also gave me another idea that I would pursue. Are the French vets regulated as per our veterinary surgeons? The UK have the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons who have strict codes of practice for members. It would be worth asking them for any contact deta9ils of a French counterpart. Details as follows:

Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons
Belgravia House
62-64 Horseferry Road
London SW1P 2AF

Tel: (020) 7222 2001
Fax: (020) 7222 2004
Email: admin@rcvs.org.uk

Finally the name of the Head of Legal Services of Cats Protection is still, I believe, Dominic Sullivan. I would be particularly interested to know if he is any help. I have pasted details below but would suggest that you ask for his personal email address after phoning the main number.

Cats Protection
National Cat Centre
Chelwood Gate
Haywards Heath
Sussex
RH17 7TT

Tel: (Switchboard) 08707 708 649

E-mail: helpline@cats.org.uk


Please keep us posted whenever you can. The main thing is to get the 'guys' back safely and that is where the time needs to be spent.

Owning a cat is a lifetime partnership.

"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." Mahatma Ghandi

"I am in favour of animal rights as well as human rights. That is the way of a whole human being." - Abraham Lincoln

Offline Dacamoba

  • Kitten
  • **
  • Posts: 9
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2009, 10:59:08 AM »
Thanks Beanie, great advice.

Really struggling at the moment. I had already rung the RSPCA, but only the general enquiries line, so will try again. Hadn't thought of the CPL but will involve them too. I have emailed the SPA (RSPCA equivalent) and have someone in France giving me advice on the regulation of catteries (apparently is tightly regulated) so will be putting in a complaint and getting them spot checked (although I imagine they will be expecting this).

I was going to ring all the local vets explaining the situation and advising not to put my cats to sleep as this is an ongoing dispute, but we are worried that he will just open the cattery door and let them go (to spite us) and one of my cats would suffer badly if she was outside alone (the other was a stray, is very friendly and can catch his own dinner!). Its horrible to be even thinking like this, I still cant believe this is happening.

Looking at me going over there are no ferries into Roscoff, so either a ferry to St Malo or flight to Brest and then probably have to get a taxi the rest of the way! Also wondering whether to negotiate with him, the thought of it makes me sick. As he is clearly only interested in money, I thought about offering half of what he wants as a final offer and making it clear that if any harm comes to my (remaining) cats that he will never receive another penny out of me. But it sickens me to even consider it. Also gives him all the power and i'm pretty confident he will demand the rest, thinking he has me in a corner. He has already said that he can increase the 'debt' at the any time. My other problem is I only have transport for them the 8th, so if this drags on I have another problem.

So depressed about everything. It is crazy that they have all survived the long haul flights to be under threat by a evil cattery owner. Just goes to show you can't trust anyone - don't think I would ever put another of my cats in a cattery, here or abroad.

x

Offline Beanie

  • Senior Cat
  • ****
  • Posts: 399
  • Beanie
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #23 on: January 02, 2009, 12:26:45 PM »
This is a simply horrific story which has left me cold with anger.  :censored:

Whilst I am no expert, I am trying my best to put myself in your position and file away the natural anger and feeling of violence towards these cattery owners. In the interests of civility, I will stick to the legal route of suggestions.  :censored:

You do need professional legal help and the sooner the better. I would contact the legal people at the RSPCA immediately for advice. I would also seek help and advice from the Cats Protection Head Office in house solicitor. He should be of some help! Both organisations will doubtless want chapter and verse. If it is outside their area of expertise I would press them to be positive by putting you in contact with any affiliated organisations of theirs that may be better placed to assist. I believe thaey might have links overeseas which may include France.

I would also seek advice from the British Embassy and French Embassy independently of each other. I would most definitely take it up with your constituency MP &/or contact one the parliamentary group of MPs charged with animal welfare issues.

Above all and in the interests of expediency I would do all simultaneously.

I would also suggest something which I would personally find difficult. Whilst trying to keep your cool and focus at all times, never lose sight of the fact that you have to regard these people with extreme personal prejudice but without it spilling over.

Owning a cat is a lifetime partnership.

"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." Mahatma Ghandi

"I am in favour of animal rights as well as human rights. That is the way of a whole human being." - Abraham Lincoln

Offline Gill (sneakiefeline)

  • Rainbow Bridge/Rescue/Moderating Staff
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 73567
  • Misa at 4yrs old and new with me
  • Slave to: Misa, Sasa, Franta Napoleon RIP, Ducha RIP and Lupin, Kocka RIP
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #22 on: December 31, 2008, 22:19:01 PM »
Very sorry to hear about Baby, RIP little one.

As said below, Swampysmum is familiar with France and Teamswafelheim, Lottie also speaks French and has a cat from France. Sadly this being a holiday time, peeps are not on Purrs as much as usual.

Definately getting peeps involved on the ground in France must be helpful, and wish you the best of luck in getting the cats sorted out and back to the UK.

Offline Mark

  • Purrs Registered Cat Rescue
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 33326
  • Clapton
    • AnimalAid - Support Humane Charities
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #21 on: December 31, 2008, 21:42:01 PM »
Highly unlikely that he is reading this but whatever makes you feel comfortable.
DO NOT BREED OR BUY WHILE SHELTER ANIMALS DIE

I believe I am not interested to know whether Vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn't. To know that the results are profitable to the race would not remove my hostility to it.  Mark Twain

Offline Dacamoba

  • Kitten
  • **
  • Posts: 9
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #20 on: December 31, 2008, 21:35:27 PM »
Thanks Mark,

I have left an email for them tonight and will try to ring tomorrow. Still no response from the cattery, he did promise to reply by today but I didn't expect it - even now he is dragging it all out,  I wonder why? I am starting to think that I would be best going there with the pet transport person so I can see with my own eyes what is happening.

x

Just thought he might be reading this, maybe I will keep my plans quiet just in case?

Offline Mark

  • Purrs Registered Cat Rescue
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 33326
  • Clapton
    • AnimalAid - Support Humane Charities
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #19 on: December 31, 2008, 19:46:01 PM »
I know this lady isn't in Brittany but wondered if she might be able to advise http://www.wetnoseanimalaid.com/proj.asp
DO NOT BREED OR BUY WHILE SHELTER ANIMALS DIE

I believe I am not interested to know whether Vivisection produces results that are profitable to the human race or doesn't. To know that the results are profitable to the race would not remove my hostility to it.  Mark Twain

Offline Millys Mum

  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • ******
  • Posts: 11930
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #18 on: December 31, 2008, 18:40:19 PM »
 :welcome:

Im very sorry to read your story  :hug:
Im afraid i dont believe your Baby is gone, if they are being such arses over invoices why havnt they charged you for the autopsy? They are not cheap to have done.  :shy:
I hope you get your fluffies home soon


Offline Christine (Blip)

  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • ******
  • Posts: 12648
  • Blip
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #17 on: December 31, 2008, 10:48:39 AM »
I am sorry to welcome you to Purrs in such circumstances.  I would say that getting French / English speaking lawyers and rescuers to help you 'on the ground' is the right move.
I'm a member of the British Humanist Association, the national charity supporting and representing people who seek to live good lives without religious or superstitious beliefs http://www.humanism.org.uk/home

Offline MrsR

  • Honorary Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 5674
  • RIP Sylvester, Sofa & Bunty - my furbabies x
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #16 on: December 31, 2008, 10:43:26 AM »
I cannot advise you but just wanted to say welcome to Purrs and I am so very sorry at the loss of Baby really I am  :hug:

Offline Dacamoba

  • Kitten
  • **
  • Posts: 9
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #15 on: December 31, 2008, 10:35:01 AM »
Thanks, yes I agree they to need to leave before the 8th. I have found some english speaking french lawyers so will pursue that route. I have also contacted a english couple in France who run a cat rescue and help non french speakers to locate their lost pets. Just hoping they will be able to point me in the right direction. Have also contacted the British embassy though they weren't very helpful.

I think because of the threats, aggression towards me and Baby's death we would have a good case to go to the Police and get an escort. If I need to, I will go to France myself, take photographs and get further evidence. Despite me requesting a written reply yesterday when I rang the cattery, I have yet to receive anything from them.

Just don't think I will ever get over Baby's death, and Christmas will never be the same again.

x

Offline Yvonne

  • Super Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 3362
  • Cleo
  • Slave to: Trevor, Clare, Spotty, Homer, Parrot, Cody, strays, Ginger Snaps and Jacob Black.
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #14 on: December 31, 2008, 10:22:34 AM »
 :welcome:  to Purrs

I am so sorry that you find yourself in this dreadful situation and I quite agree with Maddiesmum, try and get the cats out as soon as you can.

I think Swampy's mum speaks some French and I believe Helen (maccat) lives in France.  There are a few others but they have not been on line for such a long time.

I do wish you the very best and please keep us posted.

 :hug:


 :RIP:   Baby
The Purrs 2011 Cat Show!
Could your cat be a winner? 
http://www.purrsinourhearts.co.uk/index.php/topic,37101.0.html

Offline Maddiesmum

  • Honorary Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 5853
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #13 on: December 31, 2008, 08:33:49 AM »
I don't know what to advise you, could you get a police officer to go to the cattery with you?  I am so sorry this is happening to you and can only begin to imagine what you are going through.  :hug:

Offline Dacamoba

  • Kitten
  • **
  • Posts: 9
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #12 on: December 31, 2008, 07:17:17 AM »
Hi,

Yes, I am having trouble imagining she has gone. That was one reason for ringing yesterday, I had hoped it was some sort of sick joke  :( This couple has never met me in person and I have wondered whether to pose as a new customer to gain entry to cattery to look around and see for myself. But I don't think I could leave without my cats and would probably end up crying my eyes out.

I read their website again yesterday and it made me feel sick, so many lies.

Will see what progress I can make today.

x


Offline CC & The Pussycat Guys & Dolls

  • Royal Cat
  • ******
  • Posts: 8612
  • Ollie Bonga
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2008, 23:48:31 PM »
I think cattery's are supposed to have a contract of care, where whatever happens they are supposed to act like the animals owners and get them the medical treatment they need at that time. They also have to be registered, so you could check up on this, Im sure nobody would use a cattery that was not registered. So this could be an argument for your case.

I would really get someone within the authorities informed about this, it cant continue.

Also with babys case, if she is really gone you could try to prove that they never got her the medical treatment she needed, which really is neglect. Sue their  :censored: arses

I really hope Baby is not gone, maybe just a plan to get you to pay? But on Christmas day though, sick  :censored:

 :hug:
Just because your out of sight, does not mean your out of mind <3


Offline Sam (Fussy_Furball)

  • Marketing/Lost&Found/Moderating Staff
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 17472
  • Foxy (RIP), Zephyr (RIP), Rosina (RIP) & Oliver
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2008, 23:24:56 PM »
Hi and  :welcome: to Purrs ... sorry you've found us under such awful circumstances.  I think we have a few members on here who are in France and will hopefully be able to offer some advice.

I just wanted to add me sincere condolences for the loss of Baby.  RIP little one.
In ancient times cats were worshiped as gods; they have not forgotten this.

Offline Gillian Harvey

  • Cat Rescue
  • Royal Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 8530
  • Sam RIP
    • Scruffy Joe's Cat Grooming & Cat Sitting
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2008, 23:15:19 PM »
I don't know what to advise, but I really feel for you in this terrible situation and I'm very sorry to hear about Baby. I'm sure someone here will be able to help.  :hug:

Offline Dacamoba

  • Kitten
  • **
  • Posts: 9
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2008, 23:14:12 PM »
Thanks for the replies.

The only other thing I can think is to pay him, despite everything. And maybe try to take him to court afterwards, although I doubt we could afford the legal fees. Its never really been about money we just wanted the cats home safe and well.

Also, surely it is not possible to not notice a cat is dying? We took in a little stray tortie a couple of months ago (as the RSPCA wouldn't take her) who turned out to be really ill and we had her put to sleep within a couple of weeks. I can't believe anyone would let an animal suffer like that, I am heartbroken.

x

Offline Canterbury_cats (Sharon)

  • Purrs Registered Cat Rescue
  • Super Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 2132
  • Leo(Bridge babe 4/10) & Bella my darling Siamese
    • http://www.canterbury.cats.org.uk
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2008, 23:02:34 PM »
Oh what a terrible story.. i so feel for you.. But i hope that Purrs peeps can spring into action with advice and i am sure we have a few French speakers on this forum.. I wish you the best of luck and want to thank you for all the effort you have gone to for your puss cats i have to say you are so dedicated and i wish you all the best and a happy ending to this long and very emotional journey.
Cannot save the world, but if everyone does something we can have a jolly good job trying too....

Canterbury & District Cats Protection
http://www.canterbury.cats.org.uk

Please use our VetUK link on the Home Page of our website.
We want your old used inkjets & mobile phones!

Offline Dacamoba

  • Kitten
  • **
  • Posts: 9
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2008, 23:00:43 PM »
Hi,

Thanks for your reply. I know that there is the SPCA in France. I think I will contact anyone and everyone tomorrow and see what can be done. I don't know about regulation of catteries in France but imagine they will be someone who could help. I just can't understand the French websites, but will have to write my emails in English and hope they can translate.

Don't know if this picture of her will work.

<img src="http://img35.glitterfy.com/365/glitterfy165448396D33.gif" alt="Glitter Photos" border=0 />
[Glitterfy.com - *Glitter Photos*]

Thanks
x

Offline Janeyk

  • Rescue & Rehoming/Moderating Staff
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 21875
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2008, 22:59:04 PM »
 :hug: oh dearie me, I can't say how sorry I am for you.  I really don't know what to advise you other than see as a solicitor quickly as you are, maybe someone on here will be able to advise hopefully, but my thoughts are with you.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2008, 23:01:54 PM by janeyk »
Please consider the harder to home cats in rescue.

Offline caledonia

  • Hero Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 1075
  • RIP My beloved boys Bertie, Oscar & Edgar
  • Slave to: Nina & Rio
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2008, 22:56:18 PM »
I would just reitterate what Jackspratt has said - so sorry for the loss of Baby and it seems as though you are in a nightmare situation!

Hopefully someone on here may have some knowledge as I know other members have had to being their cats through France.

Good luck
Love from Rachael & fur babies Nina & Rio

RIP Bertie 23/12/2007
RIP Oscar 31/08/2011
RIP Edgar 09/11/2011

Always loved, never forgotten

Offline JackSpratt

  • Moderating Staff
  • Purrrrrfect Cat
  • *****
  • Posts: 21871
Re: URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2008, 22:51:27 PM »
I really don't know what to advise you, but wanted to send my condolences on the loss of Baby. With regards to the other cats, have you informed the French authorities about the situation? Surely there is some law regarding this kind of thing?




Carrie, Jack,Toby and Parsley ~ Love and miss you all always.x

Offline Dacamoba

  • Kitten
  • **
  • Posts: 9
URGENT HELP & ADVICE NEEDED - my cats are in danger
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2008, 22:43:26 PM »
Hello,

This is my first post on here, I am hoping someone will be able to give me some advice - its a long story.

Me and my partner moved to New Zealand and took our 3 cats with us but unfortunately it didn't work out for us and we ended up returning to the UK. Before we left we trust our UK vet to carry out all the necessary requirements including the Rabies stuff in case we needed to come back. However he did not complete the paperwork correctly and the cats could not return to the Uk without completing the Rabies vaccinations and blood tests again. They stayed in a cattery in NZ for a couple of months which was heartbreaking enough and then we made the decision to bring them into France to have them closer to us but avoiding the strict rules of UK quarantine. I thought this would be kinder on the cats.

We found a UK couple who had set up a kennels and cattery in Brittany, and they seemed very friendly and caring on the phone. I had numerous conversations with the lady, who was in charge of the cattery (her husband is a builder and told us he had nothing to do with the animal business), they had a website and seemed perfectly genuine.

We went to meet the cats in off the plane France and stayed with them for a few weeks to check they were okay, but as we did not speak French we did not start the Vets process (for PET passport) as the cattery couple said they would look after the cats for the 6 months and have the blood tests done (they had already had the Rabies vaccines twice in NZ). So in August we happily left the cats in their care.

In the early weeks, the only problem we noticed was that the lady seemed quite ditsy and not very organised. She always talked about how lovely the cats were and how she sometimes spent so long in the cattery that her husband came looking for her, it all seemed so genuine and caring. Weeks went by with not a lot happening, they kept saying they were waiting for quotes from the vets and came up with other delays but in the end the cats were apparently given an appointment to have the blood tests.

On the day, they called us to say the vet had refused to do the blood tests as he wanted to administer another Rabies vaccine. I did not agree that it was in the cats best interests to have 3 Rabies jabs in a year and was concerned, the vet had apparently said that they often get stopped on the return to the UK for incorrect paperwork and he wanted to be thorough. I had read the DEFRA website over and over and was knew that as long as the vaccines were carried out in a qualifying country they would be fine, and I was willing to risk it as the NZ vet was extremely competent and we had the correct vaccine certificates etc.

So, I went back to the cattery and told them they should take the cats back to the vets to just have the blood tests, and we would not hold the vet responsible for any problems down the line. By now we had made payments to the cattery, but the figures quoted always seem to change on the phone, again the women did not seem to be very good with the money side of things, and I asked for her to quote in writing by email to keep everything on track (she never did this). When I paid for September, she rang a week later and was a bit offish saying we were in arrears (of only about 50 euros) but I had paid into her (British) bank account the exact amount she had said on the phone, so felt a bit let down. Then the following month I once again checked the amount on the phone before depositing but this time the husband rang me saying I was £250 short (even though they always quoted in Euros and we converted to £'s). I was absolutely shocked so me and my partner checked our records against an invoice email that luckily we had received from them and we worked out we were actually in credit for the Vets fees and up to date with board.

This is when things really turned bad.

We were now in November, the cats were no closer to returning to the UK and as this is what we were paying them to do we felt very let down. We felt that the £500 a month we had been paying had gone down the drain. So I decided not to stand for it any more. I told him that we would not pay anymore until they sent us proper receipts for money paid, invoices in advance in writing and something from the vets to advise that they would proceed with the tests. I just wanted reassurance really and for them to acknowledge that the delays were extremely costly for us and more importantly that the cats were stuck in a cattery for a lot longer than was necessary. I also requested to know why they thought the account was £250 short.

However, instead of reassurance he got very nasty (and the woman would no longer speak to me, she would pass the phone to him) and immediately started threatening to 'destroy' the cats if we didn't pay. He started harassing me on the phone so I refused to speak to him, instead decided to have everything in writing so that it would be clear for both sides. Although he was being nasty I thought the threats were just that, and still thought we would get back on track. I also felt confident that the women would still be looking after the cats as she had always seemed so timid but nice (and he wasn't involved in the care side of things). I wrote an official, formal sounding email asking again for the information I had requested and point blank told him that threats and harassment would not be tolerated. I am just disgusted that anyone (supposedly) caring for animals would act in this way.

It was December now and I had starting looking for another cattery in France and explored the options to bring the cats into quarantine as a back up. As we had three cats it was difficult to get them a place, but I found a cattery (and the transport to move them) that would take them on 8th January. By now it was just a matter of waiting to get them out, I continued to politely reply to his emails but still did not come to any agreements, he just continued to send me invoices (and each was slightly different for the same period, one even stated that September had 32 days!) and did not answer any of the questions I had or showed any compassion. The only thing I was worrying about now was if he would not let the cats be collected. I also tried to find a solicitor as I felt it was the appropriate time to send an official letter and get some advice. I couldn't get a local solicitor as they said I would need specialist advice and knowledge of French law. I wondered whether to send a bag of Iams to the cattery so the cats would not suffer because of the dispute, but my partner said no and the cattery never requested anything.

His deadline for 'destroying' them was the end of December so we have been extremely upset and worried about their welfare. I stated this in an email and advised that we would do a spot check on the cattery and visit sometime in December. He replied saying the opening times and that we were welcome to visit. As we don't drive, we couldn't really get to rural Brittany easily so haven't visited and wanted to put the money towards the next catteries deposit. I continued to feel that the cats were at least still being cared for (probably getting the cheapest food etc but doesn't matter at this point) and felt a little reassured by the email.

Then I received the worst possible news on Christmas Day. For some reason decided to check my email and there was one from the cattery which I opened. This is the exact email copied and pasted (including spelling mistakes).

"i appologize for the delay in getting back to you,

unfortunatly i have to inform you that last sunday baby died,
we found her first thing on sunday morning curled up in her bed with no visible signs of a problem,
we took her to the vet on monday morning and we instructed him to carry out an altopsy which he did and we got the resolts on friday,
she died of liver/kidney failure

please be ashured that the altopsy is at our expense and not yours,

please contact me as to what you would like us to do regarding the future"


I have not stopped crying since then, and despite requesting further information urgently have not received another email from them. All three cats were in perfect health in August and they have never indicated a problem with any of them. Baby was my little shadow, she used to follow me around the house and would sleep on my chest at night. I am absolutely devastated and finding this difficult to write now. Also she was only 6 years old and I can not understand what has happened, there must have been neglect by the cattery. Apparently she died on the 14th December and they did not bother to write the email until the 21st December. How can they have let her suffer? She should have seen a vet even if she was seriously ill and been put to sleep. I can't believe she died on her own in a cattery with the other cats knowing what was happening. If I had the slightest indication that there was a problem I would have spent every last penny getting over there to see her.

Today, I felt a little stronger and as I had not had a reply by email decided to ring the cattery. For some reason I expected him to be a little more sensitive but I was wrong, they must be pure evil. I recorded the conversation though I know it could not be used in court. Have advised that the cats will be collected on the 8th (if only I could get them now) and he said he will not release them until we make full payment, and if this doesn't happen they will be destroyed on the 9th. I said to him that a vet would not put a healthy cat to sleep but he reckoned that 3 vets agreed with the course of action.

I also stated that this was not non-payment, this was a dispute which I am quite happy to settle in court, but this will not be a quick process. I am obviously beside myself with worry over the other cats and will not agree to leave with him whilst the money matter is settled. All I have tried to do for the last few months is try to get things on track and now feel like I want to give up completely, but obviously have to save my other cats.

We would turn up at the cattery ourselves to get them but I know that on his property we can't just break the cats out, we will end up in the wrong and arrested in France. It is blackmail and I don't have enough time to get the legal help I need to fight him. My partner believes that he is bluffing about killing the cats but how can we take that risk? I can't. In my eyes he has already killed one of my babies. Also, I want to take this further so no other cats and owners go through this again. I believe he has got away with making these sort of threats before to other  people and he must be stopped. He tried to say on the phone that this is all my fault but I know I tried to do the right thing and he obstructed. I just wish I could bring my Baby back, she was so special to me.

I also now believe that right from the beginning it was all lies and they just wanted to extract money from us. They obviously do not care one bit for cats. I am terrified that we will loose the other two, I can't sleep and keep crying. I am also pregnant and have a 9 month old baby to look after so the stress is not good at all.

Tomorrow I will try the solicitor route again, maybe a letter from them would prevent him hurting the cats? I feel like we don't have many options. He refused to tell me the name of the vets they use which again seems very suspicious to me.

If anyone has any advice please help, I am at the end of my tether. I don't speak French otherwise I would ring all of his local vets to find out what has happened, as I am the owner surely they would have to tell me. I am also worried that he wouldn't bother paying to have the cats put to sleep and just make them feral but they would suffer so much and I would never know.

Thanks in advance for any replies, I am very grateful. Sorry it is so long.

xx





 


Link to CatChat