Help! Anyone know about website law - paid for an order with Viovet -cat food for rescue ...

[Tan]

On that note Tan have you have you had the refund yet? 

Refund came back on the Purrs card today.

Hopefully Les has all the fud now   and her gorgeous babes in her rescue care are scoffin themselves 

[Sam (Fussy_Furball)]

Excellent news ... well done PAH.

[Tan]

That's bril Les hun 

Just had email to say 2nd part has also been dispatched 

Love to you and all your little rescues there hun 

[LesleyW]

First food despatch from Pets at Home has arrived.   THANK YOU SO MUCH EVERYONE.

[Rosella moggy]

On that note Tan have you have you had the refund yet? 

[Pinkbear (Julie)]

I've actually been defending PAH for a couple of years now because their whole approach to helping rescues etc. has improved radically on what it was. They are still not perfect but there's solid signs the intent is there to do good things through all kinds of stories I hear about... they continue to grow in my esteem. 

As for that other bunch... "intermittent problems processing payments'' smells like they haven't paid their merchant bills to the sevice provider. They sound about to go up the bucket.  5 Days is par for the course for straight forward automatic electronic refunds but a reputable company would ask the service for a rush refund. Trouble is that costs a fee and, err.... did I say they were going up the bucket? 

[Tiggy's Mum]

A valuable lesson learned, shame it was at the expense of feeding poor rescue cats Stick to reputable retailers such as www.petsathome.com or www.vetuk.co.uk

Incidentally VetUK donate 5% of the order total to rescues if you click through a rescue link - CovCats, Paws Inn & Canterbury CP all have the link on their website.

[Tan]

Never heard of any trouble with the vet practice they have, just upset how our order was treated on their website. Thanks to Pets at home and us being able to get the bulk food at a good price, i won't be taking the order trouble any further but i do hope that they put in place on their website notices if any stock is a clearance item and so only on special offer for that limited stock and also not take payment until dispatch if they will only enter into a contract of sale on dispatch of the order.

[Daisymac]

It says on their website that Viovet work in conjunction with a veterinary practice in Hertfordshire - would love to know which one.  Certainly wouldn't want to go there.

Looks like the vet practice is a family one - Luke Cousins deals with the farcical website and (Daddy?) John Cousins is the dispensing vet.

VioVet medication dispensing under control of John Cousins, BVSc, MRCVS.
Web & IT systems development and maintenance by Luke Cousins.

LOl Great minds Lesley !!

[LesleyW]

http://www.caytonvets.co.uk/index.php


For anyone in that area, this is the vets they are in conjunction with and they also run a cattery - Cats Whiskers

[Tiggy's Mum]

It says on their website that Viovet work in conjunction with a veterinary practice in Hertfordshire - would love to know which one.  Certainly wouldn't want to go there.

Looks like the vet practice is a family one - Luke Cousins deals with the farcical website and (Daddy?) John Cousins is the dispensing vet.

VioVet medication dispensing under control of John Cousins, BVSc, MRCVS.
Web & IT systems development and maintenance by Luke Cousins.

[Tiggy's Mum]

Had to laugh at this! Looks like they are having trouble taking payments, shame they didn't have trouble taking payment for items they had no intention of sending out 

Payments: We are experiencing intermittent problems with processing payments at the moment, so please do try but if it fails then you should find it works again shortly. Once we are happy that the payment provider has resolved all issues we will remove this message. This is not a security issue, don't worry! 

[LesleyW]

It says on their website that Viovet work in conjunction with a veterinary practice in Hertfordshire - would love to know which one.  Certainly wouldn't want to go there.

[Sue P (Paddysmum)]

But these companies do not take the money  at the time order - only when the items are dispatched!!!!! That is the difference !!!

Exactly so.

I suspect Viovet is an offshoot of the insurance company "OneCall" with whom I'm in similar dispute over refunds - bin 21 days and I haven't had a penny of my dosh.  Thieves and brigands - I say it again - thieves and brigands!

But well done Pets At Home.  Has altered my opinion of them somewhat.

[Tan]

I am disgusted by viovet's behaviour.  Making a mistake and then not honouring the price is annoying and disappointing but perhaps understandable.  But by taking the money and then saying it will take 5 days to refund, they are preventing you from purchasing elsewhere and therefore causing a delay to what was an urgent need.  I think they are relying on the fact that most people will not pursue this type of thing and aren't familiar with the legalities.  I would have thought that money exchanging hands would make a contract, regardless of what they say on their website.  certainly I would expect it to be grounds for showing a bit of compassion.

Yes we couldn't wait for the refund as we would have missed the Pets at home offer so had to act quick as soon as we knew they would not honour the order to get a deal that gave Les as much food as poss for the money raised. 

[Tan]

So these site where a contract is only made whey they dispatch is not lawful?  Coo i know a few sites that say that on their terms!  But....

I notice on some other orders i have made with big internet companies is they have a disclaimer on the order confirmation actually saying that ....

The Legal Stuff

This email is only an acknowledgement of your order and not an acceptance amounting to a contract. Acceptance of the contract takes place when we send you an email notifying you that specific items have been despatched to you.

But these companies do not take the money  at the time order - only when the items are dispatched!!!!! That is the difference !!!

Viovet took the money on order did not state anything on the order confirmation email about a contract only in place when dispatched nor said anything about a change in price in the stock delay email!!     Nor said on their website that the special price was while stocks last! 



Yeap will confirm Viovet did offer for us to pay another £144 on top of the £163 i already paid so a total of £307 which was an offer of the 22 x 48 boxes at cost, no delivery charge. But They offer to all customers no delivery charge on all orders over £29 anyway and £307 for 22 boxes is way more than the cost we could buy in the food at Pets at Home. 

The wonderful Pets at Home order has cost £164 incl discounts for 960 pouches of Felix.  Viovet's price on their website was £164 for 1056 pouches so was the best deal we could find at the time for the rescue cats food and the one we ordered and paid for.
The difference between these two is only 96 pouches and only £15.74 worth!!! Where they get the £144 extra they wanted i don't know!! 

Pets At Home  this am has said one lot (672 pouches) has already been dispatched and one soon (288 pouches)  to be dispatched. 
Thank you Pets At Home 

[Tiggy's Mum]

Viovet did offer to do the order at cost and pay postage and card fees. But that still meant they were expecting more money. Just thought I should clarify that.....

Err, postage is free to everyone when spending over £29 and the card processing fee is a company cost which is part and parcel of running an online business which they don't charge any of their other customers. So what exactly were they offering to rectify their mistake? Nothing!

[Susanne (urbantigers)]

I am disgusted by viovet's behaviour.  Making a mistake and then not honouring the price is annoying and disappointing but perhaps understandable.  But by taking the money and then saying it will take 5 days to refund, they are preventing you from purchasing elsewhere and therefore causing a delay to what was an urgent need.  I think they are relying on the fact that most people will not pursue this type of thing and aren't familiar with the legalities.  I would have thought that money exchanging hands would make a contract, regardless of what they say on their website.  certainly I would expect it to be grounds for showing a bit of compassion.

[Sue P (Paddysmum)]

Bueatifully expressed, Rosella. 

[Rosella moggy]

Nudum pactum est ubi nulla subest causa praeter conventionem; sed ubi subest causa, fit obligatio, et parit actionem.

A naked contract is where there is no consideration for the agreement; but, where there is a consideration, an obligation is created and gives rise to a right of action.

So there Viovet

[JackSpratt]

Viovet did offer to do the order at cost and pay postage and card fees. But that still meant they were expecting more money. Just thought I should clarify that.....

[Sue P (Paddysmum)]

Tan, absolutely not.      What they've done is unfair and in breach of their contract with you.

The contract is made when the offer has been made and accepted and the "consideration" (ie the cash) has "moved" (ie been paid).  Once that has happened, the contract is binding.  End of. 

And yes, if stocks are low, then they should state "offer only available while stocks last"

Particularly interesting in light of Daisymac's order and delivery.      Thieves and brigands.

[Philip]

Shall I start a boycott Viovet page on face book ? 

[Tan]

Sue hun had another thought ... if there is a special low price say for stock clearance do the sites not have to state that ie "only available while stocks last"

None of this would have happened if at the time of the order, if Viovet's site had said that all the stock was not available at that price. I would have therefore not gone through with it and gone straight to Pets at Home to order instead.  Les would then have got the rescue cats food by now.

[Tan]

Thanks Sue hun 

When legally is the contract made? Is it per the terms of the internet site or is it when the money exchange hands?  I know that an internet site can change their site prices whenever they like and that like shops the price stated is only an invitation to make an order but not sure after you have made the order and paid and received confirmation and a stock delay notification saying goods will be dispatched as soon as stock is in, it looks like they have agreed the sale but has a contract been made at that point by law?  Or is it only made if the shop actually dispatched the goods?

If the latter, then everyone who shops on the internet can have their orders changed and more money demanded to pay for the order even after they have paid per original price advertised!    Seems very unfair

I would not do it on Purrs that price stated will always be the price peeps pay. and yes i do change the toys prices at times but whatever someone has ordered it will stay that price and i will honour that order. 

 

[Sue P (Paddysmum)]

Sorry, just caught up with this Tan, but is worth noting advertising standards have finally caught up with internet sites - any misleading ad content can now be reported and investigated in respect of internet sites as of 1st March.  Might be worth reporting.

A price shown is, in legal terms, no more than an "invitation to tender for goods" and a company can refuse to accept an "offer" made in respect of goods, but where their site has incorrect information, this will not be sufficient to let them off the hook any longer.

[Tan]

? maybe. They knew it was going to a rescue and a donation of food as i put that on the order notes

Donation of Food for Cat Rescue Eight Lives Left Rescue. If there are any delivery Problems, please call ......... . Thank you

[LesleyW]

I actually feel stupid believing their email of "let down by suppliers, but your order still active and will be delivered as soon as stock is in"
Had this stock email 4 days after placing and paying for the order.
No mention here whatsoever of "oops sorry the price on our website was wrong" at all!!  According to that email i thought the stock would be sent when in!
1st i knew they would not deliver the goods ordered and paid for is when they actually rang Lesley at Eight Lives left rescue to say they wanted another £280 for the order!

Now is that adding to Lesley's worry on top of all the rescue worry! 

As a matter of interest Tan, did you give them my phone number as a contact? did you give them your number as well?  I am curious as to why they contacted me about the price difference rather than you who placed the order. They had send the order confirmation and e-mail stating the out of stock direct to you.   Were they just hoping I would pay up without querying it or contacting you?

They had my number with the account set up but i did say on the order to call you if there were any delivery probs ie  thought if you were out at time of delivery etc .  I had Purrs details for the billing and yours for the delivery so they should of rang me not you about the price!!

 

Interesting . Perhaps they thought I would not know purchasing details and would just pay excess.

[Tan]

I actually feel stupid believing their email of "let down by suppliers, but your order still active and will be delivered as soon as stock is in"
Had this stock email 4 days after placing and paying for the order.
No mention here whatsoever of "oops sorry the price on our website was wrong" at all!!  According to that email i thought the stock would be sent when in!
1st i knew they would not deliver the goods ordered and paid for is when they actually rang Lesley at Eight Lives left rescue to say they wanted another £280 for the order!

Now is that adding to Lesley's worry on top of all the rescue worry! 

As a matter of interest Tan, did you give them my phone number as a contact? did you give them your number as well?  I am curious as to why they contacted me about the price difference rather than you who placed the order. They had send the order confirmation and e-mail stating the out of stock direct to you.   Were they just hoping I would pay up without querying it or contacting you?

They had my number with the account set up but i did say on the order to call you if there were any delivery probs ie  thought if you were out at time of delivery etc .  I had Purrs details for the billing and yours for the delivery so they should of rang me not you about the price!!

 

[LesleyW]

Lesley you dont by any chance come anywhere near Windsor or Amersham do you ?,   if so I could get the food I got from them to you,  it is not a lot but it would help,  I cant post it as it would cost more than the food is worth.

Don't be silly, you bought that for you and it is certainly not your fault that you got it at the right price and mine didn't get accepted.  Your cats deserve their munchies.

[Daisymac]

Lesley you dont by any chance come anywhere near Windsor or Amersham do you ?,   if so I could get the food I got from them to you,  it is not a lot but it would help,  I cant post it as it would cost more than the food is worth.

[LesleyW]

I actually feel stupid believing their email of "let down by suppliers, but your order still active and will be delivered as soon as stock is in"
Had this stock email 4 days after placing and paying for the order.
No mention here whatsoever of "oops sorry the price on our website was wrong" at all!!  According to that email i thought the stock would be sent when in!
1st i knew they would not deliver the goods ordered and paid for is when they actually rang Lesley at Eight Lives left rescue to say they wanted another £280 for the order!

Now is that adding to Lesley's worry on top of all the rescue worry! 

As a matter of interest Tan, did you give them my phone number as a contact? did you give them your number as well?  I am curious as to why they contacted me about the price difference rather than you who placed the order. They had send the order confirmation and e-mail stating the out of stock direct to you.   Were they just hoping I would pay up without querying it or contacting you?

[Tan]

I actually feel stupid believing their email of "let down by suppliers, but your order still active and will be delivered as soon as stock is in"
Had this stock email 4 days after placing and paying for the order.
No mention here whatsoever of "oops sorry the price on our website was wrong" at all!!  According to that email i thought the stock would be sent when in!
1st i knew they would not deliver the goods ordered and paid for is when they actually rang Lesley at Eight Lives left rescue to say they wanted another £280 for the order!

Now is that adding to Lesley's worry on top of all the rescue worry! 

[Tiggy's Mum]

This could have all been so different...

Online community raise funds for cat rescue on the brink of closing, food is purchased from www.viovet.co.uk for said rescue cats - the price is an error but as they have taken payment and sent emails saying the order is still active they honour the price. Happy rescue cats and lots of potential new customers impressed with the service from www.viovet.co.uk purchasing repeat orders of Frontline, Drontal, prescription meds, cat food, cat litter toys etc. Purrs has over 3600 members not to mention a huge number of unregistered guests browsing.

I actually feel a bit sorry for www.viovet.co.uk for the missed opportunity as they have now suceeded in alienating themselves from a huge purchasing audience with their appaling treatment of a struggling cat rescue 

[Ellen2010]

This is now on their blogspot lol

Would not order from these as they accept orders, confirm orders then say the items are out of stock and then demand nearly £300 when this was to help a struggling rescue out.

TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE FOR THIS COMPANY TO BEHAVE LIKE THIS

2 March 2011 09:41

[Daisymac]

They just didnt want to send the quantity ordered by Tan,  the prices were right I am sure of it,  stock clearance maybe,  as Tan knows )she also has my order number etc),  I placed a much much small order after Tan of the food at the prices quoted and a wormer for Kenny and my ordered was delivered.  They are sharks and should be named and shamed 

I wonder if Paypal would help Tan ?,  I know they are really good at disputes etc,  they may take away the paypal payment option from Viovet

[LesleyW]

£300 loss my 

Pets at Home have an offer on whereby 48 pouches (4 boxes) are £10. They also do a 10% off first online order so that's £9 for 48 or rather £2.25 a box of 12.

The viovet offer worked out to £1.97 a box (£7.87 for 48) so what they are actually talking about is 28p a box    After the appaling customer service from www.viovet.co.uk I certainly won't be using them in the future and I dare say that many others feel the same.

If the price was a mistake and they had said so from the offset then fair play but they actually sent an email confirming the order then a separate email AFTER the confirmation that the order was vaild and they were waiting on stock. In addition a smaller order placed AFTER the rescue order was fulfilled - how so if the price was a 'mistake'? Why then continue to take payment for the items too?

Thank you for your recent order with VioVet. This email is just to let you know that we have been let down by our suppliers for the following item(s) in your order:

Felix - As Good as it Looks Pouches - Ocean Selection » 48 x 100g Wet Cat Food
Felix - Supermeat Pouches - Chicken, Rabbit, Tuna & Salmon » 48 x 100g Wet Cat Food
Felix - Mixed Jelly Pouches - Fish Selection » 48 x 100g Wet Cat Food

The item(s) are out of stock with our suppliers at the moment, but we have been told that they due in with us in the next few days. We will do our best to keep you informed of any further delays or updates to your order, should they occur.

Your order will remain active and will be dispatched as soon as the stock becomes available unless you say otherwise, so please contact us as soon as you can if you wish to change anything related to this order.

Their quoted prices on the website now for Felix 48 pouch packs are all just over £22 each - that is certainly not cheap, far from it!!!

[Ellen2010]

They have a blogspot lol

http://viovet.blogspot.com/

[Tiggy's Mum]

£300 loss my 

Pets at Home have an offer on whereby 48 pouches (4 boxes) are £10. They also do a 10% off first online order so that's £9 for 48 or rather £2.25 a box of 12.

The viovet offer worked out to £1.97 a box (£7.87 for 48) so what they are actually talking about is 28p a box    After the appaling customer service from www.viovet.co.uk I certainly won't be using them in the future and I dare say that many others feel the same.

If the price was a mistake and they had said so from the offset then fair play but they actually sent an email confirming the order then a separate email AFTER the confirmation that the order was vaild and they were waiting on stock. In addition a smaller order placed AFTER the rescue order was fulfilled - how so if the price was a 'mistake'? Why then continue to take payment for the items too?

Thank you for your recent order with VioVet. This email is just to let you know that we have been let down by our suppliers for the following item(s) in your order:

Felix - As Good as it Looks Pouches - Ocean Selection » 48 x 100g Wet Cat Food
Felix - Supermeat Pouches - Chicken, Rabbit, Tuna & Salmon » 48 x 100g Wet Cat Food
Felix - Mixed Jelly Pouches - Fish Selection » 48 x 100g Wet Cat Food

The item(s) are out of stock with our suppliers at the moment, but we have been told that they due in with us in the next few days. We will do our best to keep you informed of any further delays or updates to your order, should they occur.

Your order will remain active and will be dispatched as soon as the stock becomes available unless you say otherwise, so please contact us as soon as you can if you wish to change anything related to this order.

[bunglycat]

Think i may have to give in and join facebook